Card for
Bad Credit

Dolly · #1 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 11:11

I plan to dispute them later but since I paid them, does this mean they will stay on my report another 6 years since payng them is an "activity" for purposes of DOLA? I'm really bummed because they were due to fall off soon but the mortgage co would not refi without the payment of the coll accounts.

trout · #2 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 11:14

Im in the same boat. I just paid a small one at closing. I was still waiting for them to validate when we closed. it was for 130.

jsummers · #3 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 12:20

You can always dispute.. I would wait six months then dispute as not yours.. More than likely.. it will stay.. but the majority of collectors.. will only keep records on hand for a year or so after collection.. and are far less likely to validate it..

Saying you paid it for a mortgage wont really help you out... They will basically say, well paying it validates it.. So just go the route of out and out denial about the account.. I would do it about every six months..

One thing to keep in mind.. I have had far greater success... disputing one item at a time with all the CRA's then when I disputed 5 things at once.. I think when you dispute alot, they think something is up.. even if it isnt, and just hit validated all the way down the row.. Is it illegal not to validate it the correct way and then report the findings sure.. But do they always follow the rules.. Dont kid yourself.. The only one I have had any trouble was with TRW they wont delete as quickly as the other two..

Best of luck

scout · #4 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 12:22

Paying an old collection does not restart the "clock". However, when the TL is updated to reflect the payment, it can hurt your scores by making it "look" new.

If disputing doesn't work, try the nutcase series in a few months.

NanaC · #5 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 12:27

You know, I had some luck when I closed on my house. I paid an old one...and it was removed. On their own, go figure. Maybe you'll get lucky, too! :) Thinking happy thoughts!

jsummers · #6 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 12:31

Quote:

Originally posted by scout
Paying an old collection does not restart the "clock". However, when the TL is updated to reflect the payment, it can hurt your scores by making it "look" new.

Cant agree more, However they had no choice.. Which really sucks.. Cause it does make it look new to the FICO scoring system.. Which will drop your credit score..

As far as collections, never ever pay a collection unless you can get them to agree to deletion of the account in writing for all three CRA's.. I am not saying you shouldnt pay what you owe.. as I am a firm believer in that.. But they have to be willing to work with you..

I once paid a collection, then a year later after diputing several times all with validation.. I called spoke to the manager of the collection agency.. Agreed to a $100 "admin" fee, for deletion.. Talk about a bunch of dirty crooks.. But hey it was off within 2 months.. No problem, and my score went up 30 points.. Did this to secure a lower rate on the car I was buying at the time..

Hope some of this helps.. if not.. Hey I burned up some minutes in the office.. :)

sassyinaz · #7 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 13:22

Quote:

Originally posted by jsummers
You can always dispute.. I would wait six months then dispute as not yours.. More than likely.. it will stay.. but the majority of collectors.. will only keep records on hand for a year or so after collection.. and are far less likely to validate it..

Why would you wait 6 months and why will it more than likely stay?????????? That's nuts!
Most CA's don't and can't properly validate.

Dolly, have you requested validation, sent a validation letter previously? did they respond? Is it reported correctly? Is it reported correctly on all 3 reports and all 3 the same? Have you read Doc's nutcase letter?

Paying doesn't restart the reporting clock so you won't have to live with it another 6 years.

Saying you paid it for a mortgage wont really help you out... They will basically say, well paying it validates it.. So just go the route of out and out denial about the account.. I would do it about every six months..

Paying validates it? I think you are confused about validation and the differences between validation responsibilites under the FDCPA and responsibilities under the FCRA.

CRA's don't validate anything.

Deny it??????????? Why does she need to admit or deny anything, what's that based on?

One thing to keep in mind.. I have had far greater success... disputing one item at a time with all the CRA's then when I disputed 5 things at once.. I think when you dispute alot, they think something is up.. even if it isnt, and just hit validated all the way down the row.. Is it illegal not to validate it the correct way and then report the findings sure.. But do they always follow the rules.. Dont kid yourself.. The only one I have had any trouble was with TRW they wont delete as quickly as the other two..

Again, CRA's don't validate, so they can't just hit validated all the way down the row, nor is it illegal for them not to validate.

Dolly, if the items are reported correctly and reported the same from all 3 CRA's, I'd consider the nutcase series and/or Bauer's nutcase letter. There are links to the nutcase versions in the FAQ (it's pinned at the top of the messages) as well as the FCRA and FDCPA.

If not, I'd dispute the information as inaccurate and request validation from the CA's per the FDCPA and/or dispute the information as inaccurate, not complete, not updated, not verifiable under the responsibilities of information furnishers under the FCRA. You need to read first, consider the tradelines specifically (how old are they, SOL's etc), consider your previous communications and responses with both the CA's and the CRA's before deciding how to proceed.

I wouldn't wait 6 months to dispute with the CRA's either, it is just as likely the CA's will not respond (which equates to deletion by the CRA) because you have paid and that's what they wanted all along, money. How you dispute them with the CRA's depends on what you did or didn't previous to having paid and previous disputes, if any.

Sassy

Best of luck

jsummers · #8 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 13:42

quote:

"Why would you wait 6 months and why will it more than likely stay?????????? That's nuts!
Most CA's don't and can't properly validate."

Well sassy, if this was true.. No one would have a collection account on their Credit Report.. So on this point I have to disagree with you. Reputible collection agencies have and can validate your account to the CRA's

"Paying doesn't restart the reporting clock so you won't have to live with it another 6 years. "

While this is very true sassy, it will however show as a Recent Collection due to the date on which you paid shows.. Which is worse then just leaving the account unpaid..
Example.. Unpaid Collection account 2 years old.. Minus 30 Points
Example Paid Collection account that was two years old paid showing paid as 01/04/2003.. Minus 60

Scores are just a example.. but also very much true.. Sure the account will finally drop off within the orginal 7 years..

But paying a collection account without a agreement to deletion, is only going to hurt your credit score.. Unless it is a very recent collection.

"Paying validates it? I think you are confused about validation and the differences between validation responsibilites under the FDCPA and responsibilities under the FCRA."

While I am sure your FDCPA & FCRA rules for validation are very much so true and valid.. Do you think all rules are followed.. or even for that matter inforced by anyone.. on a regular basis.. NO

"CRA's don't validate anything."

Your correct, the CRA does not validate, they ask for validation which if it doesnt come.. They delete or modify the tradeline.. To what you have requester.

"Again, CRA's don't validate, so they can't just hit validated all the way down the row, nor is it illegal for them not to validate."

Sassy, when the collection agency provides the proof the account was report correctly.. How do the CRA's note your Tradeline.. They actually, hit a button called VALIDATED.. Its true.. Check around..

"I wouldn't wait 6 months to dispute with the CRA's either, it is just as likely the CA's will not respond (which equates to deletion by the CRA) because you have paid and that's what they wanted all along, money. How you dispute them with the CRA's depends on what you did or didn't previous to having paid and previous disputes, if any. "

The only reason I say wait the six months, is due to my own personal experience and friends I have that mange some small collection companies.. I tried to dispute a collection, and it was verified, I belive 18 months later.. It was deleted from all three CRA's

Sassy, while I do agree with your points on alot of things as far as the regulations and rules of validation.. Getting the CRA's to follow or for someone to actually inforce these laws besides the consumers themselves.. Is a long shot at this point in time.

I hope I didnt come off as a pompus ass... cause you are obviously a very intelligent person on this matter.. However, I am not as green as your post may imply.. The information I post.. Comes from a couple places.. My owner personal experience cleaning my credit reports.. From my company that uses trans union on a daily basis.. and our expreiences with them.. aand from friends within TU that I have made over the years working with them. Along with friends who have gotten into Collections.. While what is done is not always legal.. and should not be done the way it is.. I hate to report it is being done this way.. at least from my experiences.. But I do enjoy reading your posts.. and am sure I will learn many things from yourself and this wonderful board

Best to all.. and Sassy.. Hope you didnt take my post as me being abrasive or abusive

Regards

waalien · #9 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 14:50

Quote:

Originally posted by jsummers

Reputible collection agencies have and can validate your account to the CRA's

Ummm, first BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA at the "reputable collection agencies"

second, no CA validates to the CRA's. They VERIFY.

Quote:

But paying a collection account without a agreement to deletion, is only going to hurt your credit score..

There ya go.

Quote:

Sassy, when the collection agency provides the proof the account was report correctly.. How do the CRA's note your Tradeline.. They actually, hit a button called VALIDATED.. Its true.. Check around..

verified, not validated.

sassyinaz · #10 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 14:55

Quote:

Originally posted by jsummers
quote:

I snipped my posts that you quoted, jsummers

Well sassy, if this was true.. No one would have a collection account on their Credit Report.. So on this point I have to disagree with you. Reputible collection agencies have and can validate your account to the CRA's

Fair enough, assuming there's a reputable CA somewhere, I've never met one nor had a CA validate. No collections remaining on any of mine or hubby's reports either.

Really?????? A reputable CA, he he he, who? I nearly fell off my chair. I'm playing with ya, I'm sure there must be one or two.

While this is very true sassy, it will however show as a Recent Collection due to the date on which you paid shows.. Which is worse then just leaving the account unpaid..
Example.. Unpaid Collection account 2 years old.. Minus 30 Points
Example Paid Collection account that was two years old paid showing paid as 01/04/2003.. Minus 60

Scores are just a example.. but also very much true.. Sure the account will finally drop off within the orginal 7 years..

But paying a collection account without a agreement to deletion, is only going to hurt your credit score.. Unless it is a very recent collection.

ok, except the standard is accurate, complete, updated and verifiable information. There's a blurb in one of the opinion letters about even accurate information that is misleading not meeting those standards. There's a previous thread, I'm thinking it was edoggie, who was fighting the accuracy of reporting based on this same issue though I'm not recalling how it turned out. I'll see if I can find it.

I definately agree, paying an account without an agreement to delete is only going to hurt you, I think I'd expand that beyond scoring. A collection is a collection is a collection, no matter how it's reporting, if it's reporting, it's hurting.

Some though do delete after payment, that's the point of the nutcase, well one of the theories behind it. The CA's are paid to collect money, after that, all other energy (including investigating, updating, verifying) and work they have to do involving you is a waste to their bottom dollar.

Perhaps Dolly can do before and after score posts for us.

While I am sure your FDCPA & FCRA rules for validation are very much so true and valid.. Do you think all rules are followed.. or even for that matter inforced by anyone.. on a regular basis.. NO

No., I think those that furnish information mostly don't know or care about the rules and laws. Shame on them too, I say, because that is just what the laws are to address. Not just the FCRA and the FDCPA but the state laws and laws related to unfair and deceptive practices as well.

Enforced, well ummmm, you got me on that one. Nup, nothing is enforced without a complaint or lawsuit. Nothing happens at all without an act first by the consumer, nada - zilch - zip, you get the idea ;-)

I guess it depends how you want to pursue it. If you don't want to be a squeaky wheel and file complaints with the BBB, State AG, FTC, Department of Banking, Licensing Agency, Bonding Agency, ACA and other collection organizations. Complaints with the OC as well! Complaints are free, they do require energy and follow-up though. Court isn't free but it's always an option. Then there are those amongst us who don't want to go court and won't, no matter how right they are.

You're right though, there's no active enforcement and the reporters use that -- they'll also pay big for it eventually, I believe. Because people that do business that way and blatantly disregard the laws that govern their business will eventually be sued and have complaints filed that will make a difference. Corrupt they are, all the more reason to pursue, it's a matter of principle I say, but I realize it is not for everyone.

Your correct, the CRA does not validate, they ask for validation which if it doesnt come.. They delete or modify the tradeline.. To what you have requester.

The CRA's verify. They are required to reinvestigate. The information furnishers are required to investigate. They both have responsibilities under the FCRA -- they aren't lumped together.

You're right though, what it says and what it is are two different things. That goes back to my above rumblings and what you ultimately intend to do about it. Walk the talk, I say! And that's where my experiences come from. I do expect the laws will be followed, if they aren't, I'll be taking action. That is the basis of my posts and where I come from -- if you aren't willing to follow-through then ignore me please.

Sassy, when the collection agency provides the proof the account was report correctly.. How do the CRA's note your Tradeline.. They actually, hit a button called VALIDATED.. Its true.. Check around..

There's a button called "validated" really? Kinda like my "enter" key but it says "validated" on it? Interesting, I will check around, thanks for the heads-up.

The only reason I say wait the six months, is due to my own personal experience and friends I have that mange some small collection companies.. I tried to dispute a collection, and it was verified, I belive 18 months later.. It was deleted from all three CRA's

Fair enough. I'm assuming then, if verified, it was reported correctly, yes? and the same on all 3 reports? I guess that's what I have a hard time with and remembering. I've never seen a completely accurate tradeline, and that's not just the negatives, the positives too. I shouldn't make the assumption that everyone has all inaccurate tradelines.

Sassy, while I do agree with your points on alot of things as far as the regulations and rules of validation.. Getting the CRA's to follow or for someone to actually inforce these laws besides the consumers themselves.. Is a long shot at this point in time.

Nodding, if the consumer isn't or won't initiate action (read US) no one will. Nothing will change either ;-(

I hope I didnt come off as a pompus ass... cause you are obviously a very intelligent person on this matter.. However, I am not as green as your post may imply.. The information I post.. Comes from a couple places.. My owner personal experience cleaning my credit reports.. From my company that uses trans union on a daily basis.. and our expreiences with them.. aand from friends within TU that I have made over the years working with them. Along with friends who have gotten into Collections.. While what is done is not always legal.. and should not be done the way it is.. I hate to report it is being done this way.. at least from my experiences.. But I do enjoy reading your posts.. and am sure I will learn many things from yourself and this wonderful board

A pompous ass!!!!!!!! oh heck no, nor green. Only fave Butch Growling dude thinks I walk on water, really I kick through mud sometimes but that's about it ;-) Don't tell Butch though!

Your opinions are certainly as valid as my own, I wasn't trying to say or imply that you were wrong. Dolly has lots of options, including doing nothing, that is always an option. The good thing about this message board is the amount of postings and from varied people, it's not just one person's way or no way. Then the poster can take the information and decide what to do with it and how to best proceed.

You're not wrong, how reporting is supposed to work and how it actually works isn't the same thing. That's just not good enough for me and I get a wild hair about it. In fact, I think I want a button on my keyboard (like the validation one) that says just that, wild hair ;-).

Friends at TU and in collections, eh? that left TU even! Collections are lucrative because they prey on the unknowing for the most part, that bothers me jsummers, it bothers me alot.

I'm glad to know there are people within TU that you can call friends though. Yes, I realize they are just human beings after all, but you can't force a human being, this one anyway, to break laws that they are bound by. Surely, I'd be fired from a CRA in a heartbeat, collections too, 'cause if I knew it was wrong, I wouldn't do it. Where are their ethics? Doesn't this bother them? Do they not know? or do they believe that's just the way it is and they can't make a difference, afterall they are consumers too? I'm curious truly what your friends would say in response. Ask them too please, what do they believe would create changes in that corrupt industry? Do they know how corrupt it is?

Best to all.. and Sassy.. Hope you didnt take my post as me being abrasive or abusive

And to you too, jsummers, I didn't take your post as being abrasive or abusive or pompous either. No worries!

There are always more than one path to the same end. It's the journey that matters, I say, and the path chosen is individual, as individual and unique as that person's report. You owe me no explanation, but thank you for providing it anyway.

Sassy

Regards

jsummers · #11 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 15:18

Sassy, sorry no button called validated.. It is infact Verify a check box or button depending what screen they are on next to the disputed tradeline... blunder on my words validate.. verify.. so close yet so far... :) .. I have spoken to my friends at the CRA's and to be honest, they truly do not give a rats ass.. They feel the company gets what it pays for... These friends, make crappy money while that does not justify not doing a job correctly.. Being in management.. I know that if I pay enough were they know they cant just go on a interview or two and get what they are making now.. They will work harder to make sure they keep that job.. I am very glad their are people like you that will take this too the hilt and file the lawsuits and so forth.. Being a guy who works way to much, and to be honest.. Whos credit isnt really that bad.. I dont have nor try to make the time to do as much as I should.. Which I know I should, since it is important..

As far as my buddies who have gotten into collections.. I am glad they are my friends lets just say.. they are some sadistic people in that industry.. Re-aging accounts.. Promising deletion for payment but never doing it.. Not updating the CRA's at all.. It all comes to how you delt with them, if you were decent and not too big of a ass.. My buddy said he will help them out.. If you get a call and threaten legal action and so forth.. They actually get enjoyment messing with your life.. Is it right no.. Is it done yes.. To tell you the honest to god truth.. I dont know the exact legal way it should be done.. I just know how it is at times done..

My friends at both the CRA and Collections say.. People would be really surprised what a pleasant respective conversation can get you.. He also said.. tell them, you know its not their fault and they are just doing a job.. I guess they really appreaciate this as many of them get attacked all day by people.. If you happen to be the nice one.. Who knows.. They may delete the account..Right then and there.. YES it happens with no Validation from the Creditor and no formal VERIFICATION.. ;) from the CRA.. Is it right.. NOPE.. is it done.. YEP..

and sassy, you mean you cant walk on water.. :(

Think you and I will have plenty mroe occassions to talk in the future on this site.. Best to all

Regards

sassyinaz · #12 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 17:21

Dang me, jsummers,

I'm still gonna get a wild hair button!!!!!!!

Your friends don't give a rat's ass, eh? well, at least you get a straight answer. Maybe I should send them all wild hair buttons, he he he! The sad truth is they are under-paid, not appreciated, not respected and likely over-worked too with power-tripping supervisors that belittle them. Nodding, companies do get what they pay for and jobs aren't always about money, but it's a good start.

Shame on you TU, WAVING, why don't you make the cubicle rounds and say thank you to some of those employees, and mean it, give them their break they've been working through!

I'm glad your credit isn't that bad, jsummers, nor is mine anymore, thanks to this board. There are people like me though that are tired, sick and tired, disgusted (where's that wild hair button) with having to pay double, triple and quadruple in money, that's real money, the hard-earned green stuff, for financial decisions that are based on a bogus credit report and rating based on willy-nilly reporting depending on someone's mood or lack of sex or demented sense of self-worth.

I had a heart attack at age 33, no history, exercise, no drugs, not overweight -- it came from no where predictible; lost my job of 10 years. I'm like the rest of the working world, or most of them, 2 incomes - 4 kids, mortgage, 2 cars, yada yada. It was, what it was, I learned from it (HUGE lessons there but that's another topic) and live with it.

Anyway, I'm working on 39 now, sooooooo, here's the nutshell version: heart attack, job loss, down one income, bills start spiralling, we refinance house. Have never done that before, mortgage privately carried. End up with a predatory lender (didn't know that then) that has no mercy. Mortgage is 2 payments late, we're gonna foreclose. Declare Chapter 13 bankruptcy, 100% repayment so we don't lose any property. Refinance again, pay off the C13, this time with a lender (well sold to a lender) worse than the first.

I'll take responsibility for being stupid and not understanding the mortgage process, nor that predatory lenders existed in the world, and for believing that laws existed to keep those things from happening, for not even having a clue that they could happen - starting with the slimey broker that ushered, God-blessed, and took his 10% in the whole bend over deal.

But, I will be damned and dead, bury me now, before I accept that I have to live with paying 2-4 times the interest rate of the rest of the world for having had a heart attack and being stupid, all because your friends (ok, not just your friends but the employees of the CRA's and CA's) don't give a rat's ass or get off on being sadistic!

I have no choice but to find and make the time! That is not to say I'm not nice, I'm always nice, nor am I above sucking up, if that is what works. I'm a nice hard-working person whose back is against the wall. It's more like a crap shoot.

This is real money, hundreds of thousands of dollars, just from my life and my family's life. This isn't a sassy pity-party, there are 100's of others here in the same shoes, I'm not looking for pity, just fairness in dealing with my financial life. I'd not be here if the laws were followed and I just had bad credit that was accurately reported.

I just can't figure out why your friends (and the rest of the employees) don't understand the impact and why those that do get off on being sadistic and messing with my life.

No doubt though, one day they'll be forced to understand because none of us (them -- they are part of the us) are immune and protected from illness, disease, or life happenstances.

Those that are in minimum wage, entry level, no opportunity jobs (read your friends and their co-workers) will find themselves in worse shape because they don't have the means to do anything but take a direct credit hit on their reports and/or loose their own homes and/or take that long walk to the BK Court and STILL live with the results of inaccurate reporting.

Sassy

Butch · #13 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 18:05

Sassy:

"There's a previous thread, I'm thinking it was edoggie, who was fighting the accuracy of reporting based on this same issue though I'm not recalling how it turned out. I'll see if I can find it."

The thread was by Jdog, and was called "Eq, and the 7 year reporting period", or somthing like that.

The other point you make, that of the report being technically accurate but still misleading, is case law. (I'll see if I can find it).

I would LOVE it if you could find an FTC Staff opinion on it too.

I need it as I'm about to pursue EQ for deleting a good TL.

Butch · #14 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 18:21

"Only fave Butch Growling dude thinks I walk on water..."

I disagree ...

I'm NOT the only one.

:)~

Butch · #15 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 18:26

Self imposed edit.

sassyinaz · #16 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 18:51

Quote:

Originally posted by Butch
Self imposed edit.

awwwww fave Butch growling dude, thank you for the walking on water response, you're in good company with Mr. Sassy, I promise, ;-)

I have to wait until Mr. Norton of the anti-viral fame is done scanning before I can search for jdog. Those dogs stick together, huh? I bet they all wear big dog t-shirts too, LOL.

I'll see if I can hunt done an FTC letter that will help you over the weekend. Could be though that you're just keeping me honest and it was a thread with case law citations. In that case, I apologize, but I'll search anyway.

And finally, how come you self-imposed an edit on yourself, I thought, ok well hoped, you were going to post some wise financial planning advice for life-smack plotting. You didn't go out and get yourself a wild hair button too, did ya?

Sassy

Butch · #17 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 19:14

Quote:

Originally posted by jsummers
.. I have spoken to my friends at the CRA's and to be honest, they truly do not give a rats ass..

Thanks for your honesty. You're right, they don't, but we knew that.

They feel the company gets what it pays for... These friends, make crappy money while that does not justify not doing a job correctly..

People who make crappy money can get a job ANYWHERE. As in, anywhere else.

Whos credit isnt really that bad..

I hope you're not here to argue with people who's credit IS perfect.

As far as my buddies who have gotten into collections.. I am glad they are my friends lets just say.. they are some sadistic people in that industry..

Everyone in that industry is sadistic. If they're not, they get fired for "not doing what is necessary to keep the job". If you're "friends" have been there longer than 6 months, they're sadistic too.

Re-aging accounts.. Promising deletion for payment but never doing it.. Not updating the CRA's at all.. It all comes to how you delt with them, if you were decent and not too big of a ass.. My buddy said he will help them out.. If you get a call and threaten legal action and so forth.. They actually get enjoyment messing with your life..

An utterly beautiful example of the kind of riff-raff the industry hires.

Here's a synopsis of Budd Hibbs commentary on the true pshyco-dynamic of the average collector, your friends;

AGENCY COLLECTORS (Beggars)
.
Correctly deemed the worst-type of collection agents! They too operate from a computer database that contains all of the information regarding you, provided to them by the original creditor. When an outside agency gets your account, it has been 'charged-off' for non-payment. They too make more then 200-250 calls a day and the name of their game is also... $$ MONEY $$!
.
An agency collector receives a commission averaging from 15-25% of what they can collect. Most are paid bonuses if they hit a quota and a good collector can make $40-60K per year, if they work hard. However, most collectors are fortunate to make half of that amount. The problem is that the majority of them (70-80%) routinely step over the line to increase the monetary rewards of their actions. The debt collection business is plagued with a huge turnover in employees and by that nature, is a largely transient industry. Unfortunately, far too few consumers complain enough about debt collectors crossing over-stepping there bounds, usually because they are intimidated and embarrassed about their dilemma. It has been my experience that the average debt collector is male, has a large ego, bounces around from job to job, have a lot of debt themselves, suffer from low self-esteem and enjoy using the telephone as an instrument of empowerment. The see themselves in a position to take advantage of those they deem weaker, in an effort to overcome their own insecurities. They normally will talk-over any issues you may have, threaten and intimidate you, lie, misrepresent themselves, abuse, annoy and attempt to push you as far as they can if the rewards to them of self-gratification and money are realized. The spectrum of collectors I've encountered over the years, in dealing with literally thousands of them have ranged from the low percentage of honest and hard working (20-30%), to the average of deadbeat scum that is either just out of, or heading back into a jail cell (70-80%). Collecting is male dominated and because of the shortage of skilled workers, agencies are hiring anyone who can walk and chew gum to make their calls. Social skills, education and career orientation are NOT normally the prerequisites for a debt collector � money beggar position.
.
From standard phrases such as: "what is your intent" to "I'm going to recommend that our client take immediate legal action against you." The innocent unsuspecting consumer feels threatened and even terrorized by the antics of terrorist debt collectors. The really bad ones will call you at work, violate third party disclosure, or worse, in order to intimidate or threaten you with arrest or wage garnishment if they don't have the money today! They persuade you to pay off old debts using your new credit card, via Western Union wire transfers, bank drafting, debit checks and cash. They will tell you your credit report will be clean and your soul will be saved fro hell, (halleluiah!) if you just send them the.... $$ MONEY $$. The National Consumer Law League, (NCLC) and the National Association of Consumer Advocates, (NCLC) assist attorneys across the country in pursuing agencies and collectors who violate the law and your rights. Collectors are learning that the phone name they use and the perceived anonymity of hiding behind a telephone can easily be overcome with the modern technology of today and investigative techniques. Some collectors are learning first-hand that they too, can be charged with making threats over the phone and that their employers do not provide bail money, or legal representation as a perk. Creditors are increasingly becoming less tolerant of agencies that allow abuse and will drop those that don't comply. I urge you to complain about collector abuse by contacting the FTC, the American Collectors Association, the original creditor and your state bar association (against attorneys), or myself if you feel your rights are being violated. There is a nationwide group of professional consumer attorneys, skilled in debt collection laws that passionately defend the rights of consumers against these illegal collectors. No consumer should ever suffer abuse from a debt collector, the laws WILL protect you!

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My friends at both the CRA and Collections say.. People would be really surprised what a pleasant respective conversation can get you.. He also said.. tell them, you know its not their fault and they are just doing a job.. I guess they really appreaciate this as many of them get attacked all day by people.. If you happen to be the nice one.. Who knows.. They may delete the account..Right then and there.. YES it happens with no Validation from the Creditor and no formal VERIFICATION.. ;) from the CRA.. Is it right.. NOPE.. is it done.. YEP..

Really? I thought it took 90 days to update a TL - lol.

No standard by which each person is to be dealt with, it's left up to the whim of the nitwit on the other end of the phone. God help us. No ... God help them, because we're not takin it anymore.

And frankly, if these are the people you have chosen as friends, your judgement is quite suspect.

All that said; Welcome to the board.

:)

Dolly · #18 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 19:19

Thanks to all the great info. And I will post my scores before and after.
PS Sorry it took me so long to respond. I was hiding in my cube typing at work. . .then my computer crashed! Go figure.

waalien · #19 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 19:19

Quote:

Originally posted by Butch

The other point you make, that of the report being technically accurate but still misleading, is case law. (I'll see if I can find it).

I would LOVE it if you could find an FTC Staff opinion on it too.

I need it as I'm about to pursue EQ for deleting a good TL.

Yup, I'm about to pursue EQ for changing the "status" and "balance" dates on a collection to match the "reported" date. It looks like I JUST paid this collection, instead of reflecting that I paid it SIX YEARS AGO.

They did the same thing to DH, now to me (same collections) and now I can go get 'em. :)

So I also look forward to seeing what you find, Sassy :)

Dolly · #20 (**permalink**) 01.03.2003, 20:04

I just pulled my scores.
Pre-paid collection, my scores are as follows:
Eq- 01/03-592
Exp-01/03-598
TU-01/03-605

My refi literally closed on Monday, Dec. 30. and it appears that no new info has been considered in my crs as I pull about every other day.

I guess I'll check again in two weeks unless any of you think I should check earlier.

I'll keep everyone posted as to what occurs b/c of the paid collections.