Sent DV to CA and got 10 pages of payment history and a sheet showing a balance with the front page letter stating you asked us to validate and the attached is validation of your bill, please send payment to stop further collection activities. Is this a real validation? when I asked for them to validate the debt and to send proof the OC gave you permission to collect this alleged debt. Any info appreciated.
That's better than most. Read the FDCPA to find out what the law says, but the relevant portion is: So, my view from the cheap seats is that's as good of a validation as it gets.
In short, validation needs to show that 1) You are the correct person (who owes this debt), by matching name, SS#, address or previous address(es). 2) The declared amount owed is correct; this can be done with OC documents showing balances, and a summary of charges, interest, fees, etc. that detail the stated balance. 3) That the CA has legal right to collect the debt; i.e. they have purchased the debt, or it has been assigned to them. Also, they have the legal right to conduct business in your state of residence, or state where debt was incurred. This can be proved by licenses, posted bonds, etc. In short, evidence of complaince with your state laws for practicing the business of debt collection. No court has yet laid down hard black and white requirements for (proper) validation of a debt. It has been a case by case basis mostly, and as the analogy goes, it is like "good art", they'll know it when they see it". But based on the description you gave, I would say the CA has provided acceptable validation. It would probably stand up in court.
I would say so too but then will what they sent you comply with all of the TILA requirements? Most likely not. I've never seen a CA provide TILA compliant validations yet and I probably never will. So, even if they properly validate the debt but the documents they send are not TILA compliant you can still sue them for that. FDCPA and FCRA are not the only laws that are applicable to debt collection. TILA is also applicable. Most of us are so wrapped up in FDCPA and FCRA that we forget about their violations of other laws such as TILA.
Them? Or me? It's from a debt from 2000 or 2001. I'm not even sure what exactly. Probably a credit card with Norwest bank that was acquired by Wells Fargo. It's due to fall off my reports in a year or so, but my recent dispute got rid of it for a while anyway.
Thanks for the help, I went to the FDCRA / FCRA websites and read the FDCRA and FCRA and sending a computer generated piece of paper with payments and balances is not full and proper validation. Anyone can print or make a payment schedule. Not did the paper work show who the OC was, if they have the right to collect it, if they bought the debt they do, but if they were assigned to collect it then they have to prove they were given written docs showing the OC gave them to right to collect it for them. After reading what you all posted and reading the FDCRA and a couple other websites, I have found that no court unless you have a lame judge would allow this to even get past the initial meeting. Any one of us could use excel spreadsheets to make this up if you have the proper info. No where on there docs they sent was any signature, any contract, anything. It is there job to "prove" to me and a court that it is mine, it is not my job to prove it is not mine. The burden rest on them and as I have read 90% of CA's dont have the proper and full paperwork to prove anything. Now, this is how stupid they really are, they have not marked the item on my credit report as in dispute, thats a 1k violation right off the bat. I am learning that 99% of the CA's and JDB's do not have enough proof to win in court, they are hoping all of us do not show up so they can get an easy decision. This item is only 3 months away from being out of SOL, I will play with them for a bit to get it past the time and they can kiss my butt. Even if they sue me I will find a way to push the court date past my states SOL date and they cannot collect it after that. They can report it, but cannot collect a dime. Then I will get a delete of the CA because they cannot validate to the CRA's either. Its odd, I have not heard from the OC on this for years, now these morons think they can sent me some crappy paper and beat me at it. Not going to happen. For those who are in this situation, sending you a bill is "not" full and proper validation, just proves they dont have anything else to go on. Also, did I mention I put a C&D sentence in my DV and they are calling me like every 2 hours, another 1k pay check. They are only allowed to send me what I asked for, the full validation, that's it. They are not allowed to contact me especially 5-6 times a day every 2 hours. I wanted to get some opinions with this and I thank you for all your help. I have learned allot, all of us need to fight them to the end and never let them just win a judgment because they dont have what it takes to win in court.
Depending on your state its out of SOL and cannot be collected. They know that. They will try every trick in the book to scare you. If they deleted make sure you get good copies as they cannot re enter the data on your report unless you are sent the 5 day notice of reinsertion, none of them do that anyway so it will be a goner again if they do.
The question is who provides the 'payment history'... If the 'payment history' was provided by the OC, then the 'payment history' would be validation. *IF* the 'payment history' was just a print-out from the CA's own computer, *THEN* the 'payment history' wouldn't be validation. There is *NO* obligation to provide signed proof that they have the authority to collect. If they contacted the OC and told the OC that the consumer requested the documentation, and the OC provides the CA with the documentation, it's usually more than enough proof that the CA does have the authority to collect. (I've only had ONE experience when a CA provided validation documentation from the OC, months after their assignment ended, and that was only because a suit was involved.) Unfortunately, you misunderstand SOL. It doesn't matter when your court date is; the SOL governs the COMMENCEMENT of the action. As long as they file before the SOL has occurred, the process could drag on for YEARS and not be time-barred. CAs don't have to VALIDATE to the CRAs, they only have to type "Y" on the computer screen to verify the debt. Unless your dispute is of a SPECIFIC piece of information, in most cases a cursory review of their computer systems is sufficient to VERIFY the debt to the CRA. If the dispute is a SPECIFIC piece of information; or a more detailed "NOT MINE" (as in Johnson v. MBNA -- "Not mine, the account was my ex-husband's, I was only an authorized user") a manual review of the original account documentation MAY BE required, but they could still VERIFY the tradeline, you would have to SUE and show that they did not thoroughly review the tradeline.
Nah, they have not filed anything yet. I am hoping to stall them off until it is out of SOL. Also, the FDCRa requires them to even send the name of the OC, they did not even mention it. It is a computer generated excel worksheet of payments etc. No name on it, not even mine. I cannot see this holding up in court as anyone can excel a payment history.
