Received a letter from the lawyer today. Dear ma_bear, This office represents the judgment creditor in the above referenced case. I have reviewed with our client the documents you have faxed our office and are now in a position to respond. I do not doubt that ***** Title Insurance Company prepared a check for $210.20 back in 1994 and that such check was cashed by someone. The documentation my client still has in this matter, however, does not reflect that Wards ever received such payment. My own personal experience in such matters is that such checks have been sent to wrong creditors in the past and routinely cashed without reference to the actual payee on such checks. What my client's records do show is an unpaid account balance in the sum of $676.82 when the suit was brought back in 1996. As indicated above, I have reviewed this matter with our client. They are not willing to walk away from what they view as an unpaid account, particularly given the costs they have incurred in this matter. However, given how old this matter is, and the sincerity of your belief, they have authorized me to file a full satisfaction of the judgment upon payment to our office of the sum of $319.20 on or before 12/02/02, time being of the essence. If interested pay to following, blah, blah, for the proper attribution. If the settlement amount is not timely paid, my instructions are to continue with our collection efforts as to the judgment herein. Personally, it appears to me that this settlement amount is approximately 10% of the balance due now on the judgment. I hope you will be able to accept the offer and I may close my file in the matter. Mini-miranda For some background on all this- http://consumers.creditnet.com/straighttalk/board/showthread.php?s=&postid=242629#post242629 Some questions, where is the $203 they garnished out of my account showing up. They already admitted in April, over the phone, that they have no proof. Sorry this is so long.
I would talk with an attorney over this matter. It's a bit complicated and you can likely get help from legal aid in your community if you don't have an atty. You may be able to vacate for improper service... if not, it's a fair question where your money (that's already been garnished) has been applied. If he's offering 300 and you just paid 200, it might be worth it to forget about the ideals and pay it (100 more to make it go away) .. clearly they think there's an issue of validity if they 1. have a judgment and the amount is now for 3k 2. they've already garnished you 3. Most people would just keep garnishing you until it's satisfied. Collectors don't leave almost 3k on the table if they think they can get it from you but if you pay it I'd request they vacate the judgment not just show it satisfied...that's easy for them to do given the dispute over the validity of the judgment in the first place... and it's fair. I'm guessing they bought the debt for almost nothing and they figure: they paid 20 bucks to 60 bucks for the debt (but maybe $6, 1%). They just got 200 dollars of your money.. another 300 = 500 for hardly an investment and given that you're going to fight them.. they could lose large with atty fees... regardless, I'd speak with an atty if I were you before making a decision. it's a great lesson for us all... I just trashed stuff about 10 years old... and now I think I'll start archiving in our attic instead. thanks for the lesson
Oh, now I remember what I was going to post. If they got your bank account, have you either made the account balance so small that they can't garnish anything else while you're negotiating with this atty... or have you just closed the account so he'll have a tougher time getting your money...?
Of course, the more likely explanation is that wards didnt' apply the payment correctly.. Marie | =========================== Tell me about it :MCI is threating to turn me over to a CA over a balance on final bills.I paid them a check for the full amount but they never credited it to the bills. MCI admits they got the money out of the check from my bank but they refuse to credit it to the bills because they can't tell me what they did with the money. LB 59
I wish we could use that excuse with our employers Yes, I know you paid me for last week.. but I can't account to you how I spent the money.. so please pay me again I just reread the details of this case, and it's a tough call. Sounds so wrong to me that I understand wanting to fight that atty all the way.. and yet, if the case is lost, the atty has a judgment and will garnish 3k... if they'd take 300-200 just paid... might be worth 100 to make it go away... but only with the judgment being vacated and not just satisfied... of course, I almost always fight b/c that's the right thing to do... so who am I really to say "settle".. You get what you settle for in life
No truer words have ever been spoken. Or more accurately stated "life will hand you the least you will accept". Take this decision all the way down to the bare bones business decision aspect of it. Take out ALL the emotion. If I could make this go away (including a vacated judgement) I'd probably do it. Sometimes it really is better to just throw a couple hundered bucks at something to make it go away. Consider that you're paying off the nuisance value. That's just being smart.
I am very curious about this: I reread the orig post once again (it's a lot to digest)... did you really say"The lawyer took out $203.13 from my business checking account" Is the account a DBA account with your ssn? or is it an incorporation/LLC? I'd be very curious to learn if this is even a proper account for that atty to take money from... even if the judgment on you as an individual is considered to be "proper"... He didn't have a judgment on your business...and I thought business accounts were exempt from owners' and employees' debts... Please keep us posted on all this, it's very interesting
Marie, It's a DBA account with my SS#. I understand, all your points, including Butch"s, are valid and appreciated. I have fought with it all day. But, bottom line to me, this time of year, money is tight. I'm not going to go overboard on my kids, but want them to have decent Christmas. I might consider it, if it was a different time of year. Legal Aid sent me the paperwork to vacate a judgment. I was waiting on lawyer's response (he is the one that filed for judgment in 1996) and then send out validation letter for further proof to take to court. I am leaning towards seeing what a judge will say. Edit- he wants $300 in addition to what they have already garnished.
"I do not doubt that ***** Title Insurance Company prepared a check for $210.20 back in 1994 and that such check was cashed by someone. " Have you contacted the Title Insurance Company? Was this when you bought your house? Did you have an attorney? You might very well have recourse here. I agree with Marie...I would contact an attorney. Just because their records indicate they never received payment does not mean they did not. They may have applied it incorrectly or whatever, but the burden should not be on you, IMHO. L
I actually agree with you that if the debt was paid, paying this atty again is ridiculous Good to see you have the tenacity to fight this! I actually think that the attorney's response is odd. To admit he thinks it was paid may put him in a position of culpability later if the judgment is vacated. I hope you get this vacated and exact some measure of recourse on this attorney later if that's a course of action you can take (Bar complaint would be nice). Have you been able to determine whether or not you can stop them from garnishing your business account again? I actually didn't know they could garnish a business account for a personal debt. I find that very interesting, actually. I truly have been thinking about this a lot. I wish I had already gone to law school so I could be of some real use here. My real thoughts here are that the attorney thinks there's a reasonable chance that you can have this vacated. All your documents are court ordered or via a title company. They would have a legal obligation to do exactly as the court ordered and they're completely nonbiased. Obviously they called and got a payoff for the accounts. If the atty handling this thought you had no chance at vacating the judgment, he wouldn't offer a settlement... he'd just keep taking money from your account until it's completely satisfied... so the consensus here (and with that atty) is that there are certainly substantial issues of fact in dispute..and with that you may be able to get this taken care of and vacated. I also truly wonder about the account from which he took the money... if that's proper or not. If not, nail him to the wall. I agree, I wouldn't pay another 300... I just hope he doesn't start taking money from your business account and jeopardize your business cash flow. Have you been able to get ahold of the atty whose office took care of either the settlement of the divorce or of the settlement of the house? Are there any check numbers on their paperwork? If so, you could get a check copy from the bank directly.
I keep thinking about this. Is there any chance your realtor has a copy of her check paying her fees? if so, you could get the check number and if the payouts from the title company are sequential in numbering.. you could see if your friend either could look up the checks via number or if the bank could research a block of checks for you... Eg: your title company payout checks were from 10040-10060, 20 checks in total to all people... if you can get the bank name and a check number in that block... you can likely find the one to Wards. but you know... this all doesn't matter if you can get the judgment vacated for a process issue or something similar. If you get the judgment vacated then they'd have to refile against you...which they likely would never bother to do...they'd actually notify you... and you could raise all the appropriate defenses. Couple that with the fact that they have little to no documentation and it'd be a slam dunk win. One other thought... if you can ask, how does/did your exhusband's credit reports look? any chance that this account shows up on any of his reports but shows paid in full and closed? if so, you might be able to use their own reporting against them. what website did you find explaining how to vacate a judgment?
This is when we sold the house. I included a letter from the Title Company, from the original escrow officer stating that they do not have access to these checks nor escrow files as we are required by law to keep documentation for 7 years and then it is destroyed. However, we can not archive any files from our computer system unless all checks that were issued on the file have been cashed and reconciled through our bank. The above referenced escrow number is no longer on our system so that would mean that the check you were requesting had been cashed. The escrow officer was very helpful and made alot of contacts researching this issue. I asked her about bank copies, the Title company gets all their checks back and the bank does not have copies anymore.
well...maybe the lawyer wants a check copy but perhaps the judge will see it differently... and you still have the technical issues to hit since you were never served... you have a good chance of getting this thing reversed on technical issues How about the ex's credit report? any chance it shows that account as being paid? that could prove it was paid... As for the business account, if you have an INC or an LLC then the business is a distinct and separate entity... on DBAs I don't know how well the line is defined. I know it's all still your ssn under the business account, but I'd also look into the concept of whether or not that was legal for him to take funds for a personal debt from your business account (even if it is a DBA with your ssn on the account)... perhaps another point of contention There's a good chance it's ok... but I'd look into that too. I had read that on joint personal accounts they have difficult times taking the money b/c you can't prove whose money it is.. and you can say it's the other person's money in the account... so perhaps a business account is the same (even if it's a DBA). I am wondering if you can state that the funds were all business... if then they're allowed access to it for personal debts... this is a great post feel like I'm in class!
Marie, I also talked to a NACA lawyer awhile ago (the one that won the $5.3 million from TU), he said that the legal interest rate charged in Oregon for a judgment is 9%. In the judgment it is 18%, which I didn't know at the time I spoke to this attorney. Is this legal, or could it have been different in 1996? Plus, they have put this back on my CR and re-aged it to 10/2001 from the date they garnished and changed the DOLA.
.1* Just because their records indicate they never received payment does not mean they did not. 2*They may have applied it incorrectly or whatever, but the burden should not be on you, whyspers ====================== 1*Yeah try telling MCI that. 2*MCI sure has me under the burden on this one. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Of course, the more likely explanation is that wards didnt' apply the payment correctly.. Marie | =========================== Tell me about it :MCI is threating to turn me over to a CA over a balance on final bills.I paid them a check for the full amount but they never credited it to the bills. MCI admits they got the money out of the check from my bank but they refuse to credit it to the bills because they can't tell me what they did with the money. LB 59 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ LB 59
Just a quick thought. You said the bank returned the checks to the title company so the bank does not have the check anymore. But, they should have a copy on film somewhere. Can you get the front and back of the copy from the bank?
