Hi Everybody. First, thanks to all who read this and provide me insight on how to better get a hold of my credit and finances. I will try to make this short and concise while providing details of my situation so that you may help. About 2.5 years ago my wife and I made some very poor decisions. We purchased a house on a 1 year ARM and then ran up credit cards trying to "make it our own." When I realized we were in over our heads we sold the house. Unfortunately, we couldn't sell all of the things we bought with our credit cards to pay them off as easily as we sold our house. Needless to say we got behind on our credit cards. We had a total of three cards and ran up approximately 35,000 in CC debt. When the collection calls started coming I freaked out and ignored them because I was in denial and scared. Eventually I actually answered two of the calls and got setup on repayment plans with the actual banks that held the CCs. They informed me that the plan would result in the cards being paid off in 5 years. We have been paying a monthly installment on each of the cards for a year and a half now and it seems to be working. The third card actually went to collections and has been charged off. This is an interesting story, so I will make it brief and try to get onto the current problem. The holder of the card is/was Chase and the original balance was just over 18,000. I received a call from Encore services attempting to collect the debt in full last January. They offered various lump sum settlements, but we were unable to afford any of the settlements. Finally, they let me pay 20% and payments of 200 per month. I made these payments without fail for the initial 6 month period they setup. At the end of the six months I received a call from them. They tried to settle again for an amount I did not have. They set me up for another 4 months of 200 per month payments. Again, I made these payments without fail. Four months later I get a call from Encore again. They again tried to settle with a large lump sum that I didn't have. They agreed to 3 more months of 200 per month, but said that would probably be it. I just figured they were playing hardball and would all again in three months (February of this year). They never called back. I tried calling them several times, but was never able to get through. Stupid me figured they would eventually call me again wanting to get the money for Chase, and we could continue the 200 per month as previously agreed upon. They never called. On Monday of this week we received a call from another collection agency, Client Services. They left a message on my phone of which I wan unable to receive until today (been out of town in a no service area). I returned the call thinking I would be able to continue the 200 per month payments until we are able to pay more. Unfortunately, the person I spoke with was incredibly rude and bullied me. Below I will try to quickly recount how our conversation went, what "he is going to do for us", and where we currently stand. The gentleman I spoke with was a class act monster. He was incredibly rude on the phone even after I politely told him that we were irresponsible in the past and had an arrangement with Encore to pay 200 per month. I told him that we want to take responsibility for our actions and pay down the debt (we do!). He indicated that we owe 12,588 and that he needed to collect the entire amount in full immediately. Of course I told him there is no way we can do this as we have under 1000 in the bank presently (I didn't tell him how much we have in the bank). He said he would be willing to settle for 8815, and that we should contact our parents to get the money. Neither one of our parents are in a position to help, nor should they. We got ourselves into this mess. I pleaded with him to let me continue the 200/month. He said he would need a sizable amount down (later was told 5000) and we could make 1000/month payments. I said as politely (and scared) as possible that we could not make those payments. He then tried to get me to say that we would not pay the debt. He would make statements like "So, you're telling me you won't pay" after I said we could not afford 1000/month payments let alone a 5000 down payment. He "finally relented" by saying we could pay 1000 now, and 1588 over the course of the next two weeks and then we could pay 375/month. All in all, he was incredibly rude, arrogant, and condescending. Here is where we stand. We agreed (verbally) to pay 1000 today (which we did by giving him our routing and account number) and to pay 1588 in two weeks. We will then have to pay 375/month until the balance is paid in full. I have to call him on Monday to confirm all of this. Since nearly having a heart attack (at the ripe age of 29), nearly balling my eyes out with my wife (I am a sensitive guy), and then finally composing myself enough to start research, I have concluded that I may be the poster child for what not to do when preyed upon by a possible predatory collection agency. In the last couple of hours I have read the FDCPA and other online pages regarding charge off and what not. I am still a newbie and need lots of help. I do know that Chase still owns the debt and it is listed as a charge off on my credit report (I pulled my credit while doing research). I know that this is long and probably tiresome and boring, but I ask that any of you provide as much insight as possible. I am ears. Thanks again.
Reading this I felt so badly for you. You have been @#$%^&*(IO! The two cards you are paying off to the banks are OK as they are the original creditors. I paid off BoA like this when I was in debt. That Chase card you have I don't think they still own it. ARE you sure they do? On your credit reports is it ONLY chase that is doing the trade line? What does the balance read? Encore is a bad agency, and now who is the other ? When you were paying this debt off monthly, did you get an accounting of everything? I figure you gave them 20 percent up front - that was 3,600 then you paid for 6 months at 200 a month so now we have 4800 . Then another 4 months at 200 which brings it up to 5600 then another 600, so you have paid 6200. Have you gotten ANY paperwork on this alleged debt. This second collection agency needs NOT to be talked to. If you accidently talk to them , tell them you want validation of this debt and their address and it is inconvenient to call you and all communication needs to be via snail mail. They will say they don't have to furnish such etc. Just get their address and then send them off a limited C & D and validation. Get a phone with caller ID and message and time and RECORD all phone calls. What state are you in so we can know the SOL? They probably are not going to furnish validation. If they don't they wil be in violation IF they bother you anymore. They MAY decide to scare you and tell you that they are going to sue. When that happens you hire a NACA lawyer and with all the violations you will have on them, and your stress level, your lawyer will be able to get them to go away and or you j ust may make some money back : ) These type of people look for people like you that they can bully and no matter how much you pay them THEY will never go away, unless you stand up to them. Another thing . CHANGE your bank account! NEVER EVER AGAIN will you give a collection agency your routing and checking number. NOT A GOOD THING! Oh whose credit card is it or are you joint users? You really do need to NOT pay them one more cent and STAY OFF THE PHONE!! Oh and don't get nervous about things and do without basics just to pay off these snakes. Think positive that they are not going to get anymore of your money!!! Who are the two OC's you are paying and how much more do you owe? Did you get an interest free from them? As for the verbal agreement, my, my you are such an easy mark <sigh> Again get another bank account pronto, and fast, so they cannot get the 1K out as well as any of your other money, which they WILL do, and until they validate #$%^Y&UI them!!! Woofer
If Encore is in the mix, you can rest assured that Chase no longer owns this. You were likely speaking to Midland Credit Management and they will say or do anything.
Again, thanks for the help. I am really new and still trying to learn. Please bear with me as I do not yet know some of the acronyms you use. First, with regard to the two other card companies, one of them is MBNA. We owe them approximately 10,000. The other is Citibank. We owe them approximately 4,000. The interest rate on the MBNA is 2.9% and the rate is 9.5% on the Citibank account. Can and should anything be done on those? Again, we have been making monthly payments via autodraft from our checking account to pay these. Second, with regards to the Chase account, the account was in my wife's name. Only Chase appeared on her credit report. No other parties were on the report. Is this unusual? Third, the company (CA = collection agency?) that contacted us was called Client Services. I can only assume that it is this company (clientservices dot com) The balance on her credit report reads 12,588. What exactly is a C&D? Validation? We are in South Carolina. What is SOL? What is a NACA lawyer? How do I go about hiring one and how much do they typically cost? Would it be worthwhile to contact Chase tomorrow morning to see if I can deal directly with them? What happened to Encore? They were relentless at first in contacting me, but then they disappeared four months ago and when I tried to call them I couldn't get through. Again, I am sorry for my newbieshness, but I really need the help and reassurance. I will continue to read on this board and other places as well. Thanks.
What was the initial amount? How long have you been paying this off? Is the account closed? Call Citibank and tell them you are having a very hard time paying this debt due to health problems or whatever.and you need some relief on the interest. If you do not get naywhere with one person ask for another. If they do not want to do it, call another day and see what happens. I have found that one person can help and one person won't. You know KARMA and such. You do need to however close your bank account and STOP letting ANYONE take money out of your account,as if they can do that, they are not going to settle for less or no interest,and if they know they cannot take nay m money out automatically they will be more willing to deal with you for less or no interest. You do not HAVE to be giving them as much money as you are as well. Is this account closed as well? How are they are on the credit reports? With creditors and before they do a charge off, they will many times reduce the amount, and if you can pay a lump sum, they are happy to get the debt closed. AS for MBNA (now BoA) call them up tell them you no longer have the account that they have been accessing and ask them if they can do any more for you as well. AND that all further payments will be sent to them. Make sure though you close your bank account that both creditors have been accessing and let them know you have done so, but CLOSE before, of course make sure all your other checks made out to others (besides these two) have cleared. BUT GET THE ACCOUNT CLOSED NOW!!!!!!!! No not at all. She opened the account . Did you have a card as an authorized user? Unless your name was on the app, then she is the only one responsible for this account. Do you both work? Self employed or not? CA /Collection Attorney and or collection agency. Myself a collection agency means A third party collector in my opinion is a JUNK DEBT BUYER. Cease and Desist. DO a search on this board for help on all of these terms as you really need to study what all of this is about so we do not have to explain again and again. : ) Do a search for NACA and look up your state for an attorney in your area. Again you have to do your own searching so you can help yourself. We are here to help and guide but you need to STUDY and be informed. As we have told you we seriously doubt Chase now has this debt.YOu can call and ask about the account though so you will know. They decided to move on and they probably sold your debt to the new JDB's. Again instead of just reading you should STUDY and research a lot of your questions yourself as you will learn more. THEN ask.. Here is a site to read up on your latest JDB Bud Hibbs Helps America Hold Debt Collectors to the Law! You're welcome. Remember that doing a search on the enemy is your best strategy. Woofer
OK. The research continues! I spoke with Chase this morning and the person I spoke with indicated that Chase still owns the debt. She said that Client Services had been hired to collect the debt. She said any arrangements would have to be made through them. Next, she said that if we went through a credit management company the arrangement Chase has with Client Services would no longer exist and Chase would collect the debt. I don't imagine this is a good option. So, it looks like I need to send validation letters to both Chase and the CA. Is this correct? Should I actually contact the NACA lawyer in my city now or wait until they sue? I am pretty sure Client Services is in breach of FDCPA for numerous reasons. I neglected to state in my original post that Client Services contacted both my parents and my in-laws and told them they were trying to collect a debt. I understand that this is illegal under FDCPA, as they can only contact other parties once to get contact information only. Is this correct? Once again, thanks. I apologize for asking questions that have been asked before. I need to be more patient.
FWIW, most have told you that Chase does not own the account. I know you spoke to someone at Chase, but believe me they screw up a lot. On your credit reports there are NO TL's on this debt but Chase for this account number? One time I had a Chase account. They sold it to this one and then it went thru 4 JDB's. I would call Chase and when I would speak to someone that would say that I would need to speak to the CA. I would ask if they still owned the account and would get different answers and different times form different people. On the other hand I would call CITI who said they owned the account still, AND THEY DID NOT. Again you have to be an informed person on what really is going on. Did you read the site I posted on this *company*? I still say change your bank accounts. I also don't think you have to go the lawyer route...yet.. rack up violations, keep a journal with time and date, and then when and if you get sued by this CA, THEN get a lawyer that will have a lot to work with. Woofer
Woofer and Anybody Else Reading, Thanks, you have been a great help. I appreciate your patience and time in answering my questions. I am really confused about who owns this debt. Any suggestions on how I can get legitimate answers? Will a validation letter sent to both Chase and the CA give me answers? Should I dispute the Chase TL with the Credit Bureaus? Chase shows up on all three bureaus as the only owner of the debt. I can see where the JDB accessed out credit reports on June 4, but there is no TL for them. Will a freeze on our credit reports prevent them and others from accessing this? I went ahead and called two different NACA lawyers in my area. Both were very helpful in the limited amount of time I spoke with them. I needed a little additional peace of mind. Both lawyers indicated I need to send C&D and validation letters to the CA. I intend on doing this as soon as I get back in town on Monday. I have also closed my bank account and opened a new account. Nobody will get my account number or the routing number this time. Thankfully, the 1000 that the JDB was supposed to take out yesterday had not posted yet. As such, I do not need to sell off things to make the payment and have money to live on until the next payday. I imagine they will be pissed and will probably get a nasty phone call. Any suggestions on how to record a phone call over my cell phone? That is the number they keep calling. They haven't even tried my land line. Also, if they do call, should I answer it? Should I indicate that they will be receiving a C&D by CRRR sometime Tuesday or Wed? Again, I will continue to do research to determine the best course of action. Should I update this thread or start new ones if I have different questions? Thanks again.
You're welcome. I would send a validation to the CA. You SHOULD get info back within 30 days but you may not. Validation should come from the OC (Chase) Then when you get the green card back dispute it with the credit bureaus, as if they then validate with them you will have another violation and this is a very good thing. Yes Good, an why did you call two, as the first one was not to your liking ? ? Glad you are getting peace of mind, and you will need to have it replenished often so that is why some of us are here : ) Another thing is I have found that even with NACA lawyers you need to be a good client and informed as I have won my cases with a NACA lawyer because of things I have learned here and told my lawyer what to do. : ) There ya go. You see we give you good info. Now if you decide to hire one of these lawyers did they give you a cost? to defend? : ) I am glad you took out advice. : ) Of course we are not lawyers and these are just our opinions : ) WHOAAAAAAAAAAAAa They are calling you on your CELL PHONE??????????????????? I definitely think you have them on a violation there, as this is COSTING YOU MONEY TO SPEAK TO THEM!!!! Look up in your state laws about this and also if you are a two party state (meaning you can tape them) I WOULD NOT SPEAK TO THEM! STAY OFF THE PHONE! How did they get your sell number anyway? Oh I bet you gave it to them. : ( I am SO SO GLAD that you have come here for help. : ) Update is good as then people do not have to ask you questions that have already been answered. YOu can however ask a question if it doesn't haveb to pertain to this case. So ask away on a new topic. IE Can a JDB call me on my cell phone? What can I do do get them to STOP? What violations would I have on them? Woofer
Yes, the lawyer that I actually spoke with (I spoke with a very competent secretary for the other) said that if sued the case would go to circuit court. She said her retainer is 2500 for that. I have no idea if this is reasonable or not, but I did like her. The more I think about this the more I get pissed. I am actually considering calling them tomorrow and recording our call. I think I may be able to get them to violate more FDCPA regulations. There is no law regarding conversation recording in SC. My understanding is that the courts have deferred to Federal law and that single party consent is all that is needed. So what do you think? Should I attempt this or not?
I wouldn't go looking for trouble. Chances are, it'll find you easy enough. Just be ready for it. If you go and start calling them without a good reason, I don't think it would look good, nor support your case. The only situation I could imagine would be if you called them to find out information that you haven't already requested or received, or maybe to inquire about payment arrangements. If you just go calling them to rattle their cage, that would probably not look to good (in my non-lawyer opinion).
Very well. I won't look for trouble. On a related note, I sent off the validation letter this morning to the CA. I am anxious to see what will happen now.
I have previously neglected to say what I do. I am a graduate student and just received an email from the department secratary that the JDB keeps calling them. I sent out my validation letter which included language for them to stop calling us and any third parties such as work on Monday. The USPS tracking systems seems to be quite bad as all it says is that it was sent out on Monday. Is there anything I can do to get these guys to lay off?
HELP! The CA has repeatedly contacted my place of employment and is being rude to the employees answering the phone. I am getting emails from my boss's secretary regarding their contact. I just called them asking them to stop calling my place of employment. They said they have the right to verify employment. Clearly they are doing more than that. I have asked my boss's secretary to take notes of when they call and what they say. Is there anything else I can do? I am stressing out!
You have sent off a C&D validation. What you need to do now is keep a journal of everytime they call what they said and who said it. They CANNOT keep calling your place of employment, and they are in violation. I would send off a complaint to FTC and AG, and keep copies. While this is not go ing to help much it will not hurt. I do think you should get a lawyer to put these creeps under. I enjoy it when I get a JDB calling me as all I hear is KACHING KACHING... : ) You definitely are being harassed. One more thing this JDB that is calling YOU the account is YOURS not your spouses correct? As if that was the case you would have another violation. Do a search for consumer lawyers in your area or go to the NACA website and put in your state and see where there is one close to you. Woofer
The account is an individual account in my wife's name. I have an email from my boss's secretary that says she told them they can't keep calling her/ my place of employment. The email says they told her "he said he would call whenever he wanted to, he kept calling and I am just hanging up on him." I have left a message with the NACA lawyer I contacted last Friday. I will file complaints with the FTC, AG, and BBB. Anything else I can do. I am so stressed I feel sick.
I have an email from my boss's secretary that says she told them they can't keep calling her/ my place of employment. The email says they told her "he said he would call whenever he wanted to, he kept calling and I am just hanging up on him." I have left a message with the NACA lawyer I contacted last Friday. I will file complaints with the FTC, AG, and BBB. Anything else I can do. I am so stressed I feel sick.[/QUOTE] Now you are in Texas? The lawyer you contacted on Friday,that you spoke to the secretary. Did he get back to you? If nothing came of it, call another lawyer. YOu need to get someone on this now without coughing up 2500 Try to get a consumer lawyer ok? WOofer
Send them a letter, CERTIFIFED MAIL, RETURN RECEIPT. In that letter, say that here is your address, so there is no need to contact anyone else for information about your address. Tell them that it is inconvenient for you to receive calls at any time at any number, and that all future communications is to be in writing. Ask them for proof that the debt is yours, and an accounting of how they arrived at the balance. Also ask for proof that they are entitled to collect this debt. Have anyone they contact document the date, time, name, number and company of the caller and a transcript of what was said. You're going to need a paper trail. Don't try to use a form letter for this, just write it in your own words. If they call your office, just have whoever talks to them tell them that they have been given all information they need, and that all calls are being documented.
I have already done this. I sent the letter on Monday, but haven't received the return receipt yet (obviously). I have also asked the secretary to document the phone calls. I also have the emails she sent me regarding her conversations with them. Woofer, I am in SC. I liked the lawyer I spoke with initially on Friday. I didn't know all that I know now and will be able to better fill her in on the situation. Thanks both Hedwig and Woofer for your help and reassurance.
I just feel that 2500 was too much for this case. Lawyers here charge $275 an hour and I have never had to pay more than 1500 on a much more involved case. The lawyer you spoke to can you do a lot over the internet and fax r do you have to go to the office? The letter you wrote was it signed by you or your wife? If the card is hers, I don't understand why they are dunning you. Why are they not calling her? Listen better days are coming as you have come a long way since last week. : ) It is also getting these creeps ticked off as they thought that they had a sitting duck. Nice feeling that you are fighting back, eh? Woofer Woofer
