Hello all. I'm newbie here, of course. I must say that I am quite astounded by the amount of info and support found at this site for those having problems with their credit! It's good to know that not everyone is working against you - and that there are still good people out there who are willing to help by offering their support and advice. Admittedly, however, there is just so much info out there, that I have found myself overwhelmed/confused at times. (I have discovered that one website might say one thing, and another site might say something slightly different, and then another site might say something totally different from the first two - and before you know it, you've visited up to 10 different sites/links. LOL! How do you know who's right and who's wrong?) So, to help me clear up some my confusion - I was wondering if some of you could help me answer some questions, provide some much needed advice, and help set me on the right track. Ok, here's the deal... Recently, my father had his credit report pulled and found 3 Citibank accounts that should not have been there. (We're having similar issues to this guy had - infact, it almost sounds identical.) Excel Acquisitions is listed as the collection agency in charge collecting for the Citibank accounts. One of the accounts shows up as being opened on 04/03 (closed 01/05), while the other two show up as being opened on 06/02 (closed 06/06). It should be noted ahead of time that my father has not done any business with Citibank since 1989 - when, at that time, he filed for a Chapter 13 bankruptcy and had a Citibank Mastercharge account/card listed on that bankruptcy. That was the last and only time my father dealt with Citibank. So, at first we tried contacting Citibank, and they didn't seem to know what we were talking about. (At first, we were worried there might have been a case of identity theft - so we had 2 investigations started. The first of investigation was unsuccessful at drawing any response, and the second is still pending.) We contacted Excel yesterday, 09/25/06, and received a call back from them today, 09/26/06. The rep told us that 2 of the 3 accounts were actually duplicates of the original 1 account, and that the original 1 account was listed as a Mastercharge. (Does that ring a bell or sound oddly familiar to anyone? *L*) I asked the rep if he could tell me when that original account was opened - oddly enough, he said he couldn't tell me since he didn't have the info available to him! (BS!!! If you're able to tell me correctly what kind of an account it was, then you should darn well be able to tell me when it was opened!! This obviously sounds like one of those cases where a CA will take a old debt, and relist/repost it as a newer debt.) I then asked him how soon they could remove those two additional/duplicate accounts. He said he would put a flag/notice on my dad's account and that they would review it in the next couple of days or so. So, here are a couple of questions... (1) Should we even worry about dealing with Excel, or should we go straight to the CRA's and file a dispute? (2) Should we send Excel a copy of our bankruptcy? (I have read that this is a no-no - but how are we going to prove that this Citibank account is listed on my father's old bankruptcy? Do we really even need to prove this or should they already have this info?) (3) We've had this happen to us before - twice now - where a CA has asked us for proof of our claims, we've sent them that proof, and nothing has happened. Is there anything that can be done to help protect us from this happening again in the future? Any other info, comments, suggestions, or questions would be very, VERY much appreciated!! I am just so stressed out from this matter - I don't even what to do anymore. Thank you to anyone and everyone who replys!
Is this account the same citibank account your father included in bankruptcy? If it was, and this was back in 1989, it should be off his reports by now, whether it is IIB or not.
Ontrack - yes, this is the same Citibank account that was included on his bankruptcy back in 1989. (As I mentioned before, he hasn't dealt with them since then - so why they are even showing an account, no less a recent one, we're not quite sure.) I have read, however, about some of these sleezy collection agencies that go buy peoples' pre-historic debts/bankruptcies/writeoffs, "re-age" them to make them look as if they were recent accounts, and try to collect that way. (I'm almost 100% sure that this is what has happened to us as I don't see any other way to explain it.) Any suggestions on what should be done, or how to prevent this from happening again in the future if/when finally get this cleared up and off his records?
If it was included in bankruptcy, it is not owed, period, and not only suing to collect, but any collection activity, is illegal under bankruptcy law. Sears got fined $60 million a few years back for getting consumers to "reaffirm" debts that had been included in bankruptcy, without court approval or oversite. If that bankruptcy was in 1989, it is not even reportable. There were probably other IIB accounts on his reports, but they should all have fallen off by now. You could simply dispute thru the CRA as included in bankruptcy, and also obsolete (over 10 years). They may ask for copies of the bankruptcy forms that show this account included, but this should still not result in additional negative information showing on his normal consumer credit reports. (Under FCRA, reports pulled in relationship to transactions for insurance or borrowing over $150K, or employment over $75K annually, can still show old information, if I remember right.) If that does not get them removed by the CRA, you would have a case against the CRA, regardless of what the CA claims, since FCRA places requirements on them to remove after specific periods of time. You would also have a case against the CA if they falsely verify an erroneous delinquency date. You could also go after the CA for re-aging, and violating bankruptcy laws for collecting on the debt. You probably want to dispute with both parties. 1) With the CRA to force the them to remove and block any re-reporting by the CA, and to establish CA liability if they erroneously verify. 2) With the CA to force them to stop their erroneous reporting, and to stop collection or sale of a debt included in bankruptcy. If that doesn't work immediately, there are probably bankruptcy or consumer collection law attorneys willing to take it. Your attorney may have left town, but is he still practicing in the state?
I just went a few rounds with these guys, and maybe I can help a little. I work for GMAC Mortgage. I had a borrower that had a deliquent account with these guys named as the collection agency. He (my borrower) said that he didn't owe any money to "FirstCard" that was listed, had never had an account with them. I called Excel and asked the same questions you did. They could/would not tell me when they got the debt, how much the original was, who they obtained it from, etc. That set me on edge. Just to see how stupid they really were, I said this to the person on the phone...."just so I'm sure we are talking about the same person, can you verify the social security number please". What idiots! They actually gave me the guy's SS#, even though I was the one that called them! Finally, after several minutes on the phone, they were able to tell me the original amount of the debt. According to them, it was $2200. On the credit report, it was listed at about $6600. I asked them why so much more and they told me it was for interest and fees. I asked them what they charged for interest, and they could not tell me. I thanked them and hung up. Note, I did not verify the debt was his at any time, in fact I disputed it the whole time. I called a few days later and spoke with another representative. I again asked what they charged for interest, and he could not tell me. Finally, someone that knew the rules, he said he could not talk to me about any of it, as I was not on the account. I then told him that my borrower did not in fact owe that debt and would be disputing it. I asked him for his address so that I could send him the necessary paperwork (I know, I know, I should not have warned them, but I had no address...keep reading). He said that I already had it, and hung up on me. I called back, and we repeated the conversation, but I managed to toss in there that the credit report had not listed the company's contact information and I needed that to send the paperwork. He again hung up on me. We actually did this several times, each time I would start the conversation where I left off. It seemed to me that there are only a couple of people that work there, he was answering the phones almost every time. lol...at one point, he made some remark about going the distance just to get the loan. It had already been approved, this was personal at that point... After that, I filed a complaint with the FTC and the BBB. In the meantime, I continued to call for address information, while researching the internet. I finally came up with an address for the company. I put together the validation request, along with the copies of the complaints filed with the bureaus and I even threw in a copy of the FCRA with all the pertinent parts highlighted. I included a note that indicated that my borrower intended to sue 30 days after the validation period ended if the report was not corrected. Well, I just checked my borrower's credit, after allowing enough time for the update. The item is no longer there, it seems to have vanished. I was surprised, as I expected it to still be reported, but as closed or something. There is no sign that it ever existed. I guess if you're persistant enough, and show them that you mean it, they will go away. Unfortunately, these awful people make their money from the poor people that don't know any better. Good luck!
The scenarios presented hear are fairly typical of the current crop of JDBs collecting on old OOS debt, playing brinksmanship on debts that may even be legally unreportable, or where the debtor was not accurately identified. Let's see if they have any other similar reports to the 2 above: First, BBB shows an "unsatisfactory" rating due to failure to respond to a number of complaints. www.bbb.org (Just punch in their name.) Here are 2 separate recent consumer reports on them. In both cases, they placed entries on the consumers' credit reports for accounts that were not theirs: http://www.debtconsolidationcare.com/forums/excel-acquisition.html And from THIS site, 3 cases: 2 reports, one already paid, but they are "collecting" again: http://consumers.creditnet.com/Discussions/credit-talk/t-excel-acquisitions-llc-57517.html Another report, either a very old not legally reportable account, or misidentification, but put on credit report anyway (this is the one you found): http://consumers.creditnet.com/Discussions/credit-talk/t-excel-acquisitions-llc-63990.html Not a lot of visibility on the web, but all are similar problems to your case: accounts reported on CRs that should not be there, either due to misidentification or age. Combined with the 2 reports here, that makes 7 strikes, same pattern, going back several years, not including BBB complaints. It looks like they are attempting to collect by playing "chicken". If they catch even the wrong consumer about to close on a mortgage, they could extract payment whether it is owed or not. They know how weak their case is, even to just report, since they fold on any legal contact. If this was the account that was included in bankruptcy, not only are they mis-reporting the legal status of a re-aged account, 3 times yet (both FDCPA and FCRA violations if they "verify"), but if Citi sold it after included it in bankruptcy, Citi violated bankruptcy law by selling, and they violated to attempt collection if they knew it was included in bankruptcy.
I would try writing the CA and telling them that this account is waaaaay past the SOL and that if they continue to report it, that you will sue the pants right off of them. That has worked for me twice with idiot JDBs and the items dropped off my reports the next month. If you really want to hang them, write letters to both the CA and the CRA and wait for someone to start racking up violations. They hang themselves all the time. Good luck!
Cheap OOS, IIB, and unreportable debt is cheap for a reason. If they are re-aging and collecting on an account included in bankruptcy, file a complaint with the Massachusetts Division of Banks. Maybe they would exercise more care before improperly posting collection account information on consumer reports if there were a cost to doing so. "From one of the BBB reports: "In Massachusetts, Collection Agencies must be licensed by the Massachusetts Division of Banks. Licenses can be confirmed through the Division of Banks at 800-495-2265 (from within the state) or 617-956-1500.""
