HELP!! After validating, the attorney/collectors sent me only a 12 page photocopy of the generic Cross Country agreement (unsigned and unseen by me). I put together this letter to send re 15 day send me what I need letter. Can someone check it before I send it and let me know if it's ok. Thanks so much. Linda [MY NAME AND ADDRESS] [ATTORNEY/COLLECTOR ADDRESS] April 2, 2003 RE: Cross Country Bank Dear Sir/Madame: Thank you for your prompt response to my request for debt validation pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act (FDCPA) dated March 21, 2003. However, I will need further documentation from your company so that validation of my account conforms to the legally acceptable requirements for debt validation. As indicated in my initial communication to your company I requested full and complete validation of the referenced account, and in a good faith effort to resolve this matter amicably, I request a complete itemized accounting of all transactions for this account including all debits and credits to the account for the entire history of said account, and an itemized accounting of all transactions on the account after it was written off including all debits and credits. I also request a copy of the assignment or purchase agreement for the debt between Cross Country Bank and your company. The generic photocopied agreement of Cross Country Bank which you have sent me does not in any way validate or conform to full validation. Again, the purpose of this letter is to re-iterate my request for proper debt validation within fifteen (15) calendar days. Your failure to respond or satisfy this request within the requirements of the FDCPA will be construed as your absolute waiver of any and all claims against me. If you do not respond as required by law, your claim will not be considered and you may be liable for damages for continued collection efforts. Please allow 30 days for processing after I am in receipt of this information. Sincerely, [ME]
Dont expect to get anything back, If the atty, CA is Tate Kirlin, just C&D them and go straight to the Office of the president at CCB. if that doesnt work i have a few other tricks up my sleeve, NOt limited to knowckout letter, Intent to sue letter, etc, FYI here are a few people from CCB that do not exist. but may sign letters or call. Meryl Beard, Steve Fischer, Steve Sims and Pat Lucas Jake St John
Thanks for the advice. This was written off Dec 02. Got a letter from NCO in January and validated (this is my first time). A couple of days prior to the end of the 30 day period I get a call from this new collection firm telling me they'd like to settle this account. I told them not until I had my validation (I thought it was NCO). Turns out its a new collector so I resent new validation letter to them. Within a week, they sent me the referenced "contract". It's my debt and I will attempt to settle but close to $2,000 is in late fees, over limit and 29.99% interest. That's what I want the accounting of. If I call CCB they will certainly not eliminate any of the extra fees, so what would I call or write any of them for? Did you have any luck with them after they charged off? I called in January (not knowing it was charged off) to see if they would settle and they just told me it was given to NCO - hence the original letter of validation.
I couldn't get near old Rocco! Getting to him is like getting to Hussein!! It took me days and nights of calling just to get a supervisor. They would not even let me speak to anyone in the recovery program that they have. They are nasty nasty people that start screaming at you, telling you off or just plain hanging up. I tried a PFB a while ago, but no response there either.
In the first place you need to realize that they sent you more than is required by law and in the second place you don't want anything from them at all. Cross Country Bank is an original creditor and are not subject to FDCPA so any reference you make to FDCPA don't apply to them unless you live in one of the states where both original creditors and 3rd party collectors are liable under state law. So you are probably wasting your time and your postage trying to make them adhere to FDCPA. Secondly getting the validation you are asking for is like asking them to hand you your head on a platter. If you get it then what are you going to do? What you need is for the 3rd party collector to fail to obey the law so you have leverage to negotiate a settlement that is favorable to you instead of favorable to them. If they prove the debt and act in accordance with the law then you have nowhere to go exept to pay up whatever they demand of you. Under all normal circumstances you cannot argue about the debt or the fact that you owe it. That is not only common knowledge but common sense as well. You borrowed their money and you failed to pay it back and now they want their money along with interest, penalties and whatever else they can tack on. And that's the long and the short of it and there are usually no arguments about it. You don't have a leg to stand on no matter what you come up with. And in most cases we can also assume that if you had the funds to pay the debt you would have done so and therefore would not have the problems you now have. Since you do not have the funds to pay with and they demand that you pay what you cannot possibly pay given the conditions they now state they demand, all of it all at one time and they will not give you the opportunity to make reasonable payments that you can make and redeem yourself and your credit you have got to come up with some way to resolve the matter somehow. Assuming that you are in agreement with what I have said above or at least to some extent then you have got to change the subject from one that you cannot argue about to one that you can argue about. Now then, would you please explain how you are going to do that by demanding that they prove the debt by sending you a full and complete accounting of each and every item on their billing? If you can escape paying the debt in full by making them prove that you owe the debt then you are a better escape artist than the great Houdini. Do I make sense? If so then forget about sending a second demand for that which you did not want in the first place. Another poster has suggested that you send them a Cease & Desist letter. A cease & desist can very well lead to them simply proceeding to court and getting a judgment against you. Is that what you want? I don't think so.
Sending a second demand for validation is about like demanding to become the latest Iraqi scud missile launcher. http://www.lolslideshow.com/index.cfm?page_id=86
I will ask again,,, did you call the office of the president. Not Rocco, he is the CEO, and he has no clue about whats going on in his offices, believe it or not. as sleazy as this comapny outwardly appears to be.. There ar a few really cooperative people working , you just gotta find em. try calling 1-302 -467-4600, ask for Jerry in the office of the president. and see how things pan out from there. Mind you that if the bill is truly yours, you must be prepared to pay it in order for a deletion. If its not yours explain your case accordingly. also dont expect any sort of settlement. Expect to pay the fully charged off amount, .. Im just being honest.
Be that as it may (LOL) demanding validation is not the way to get the problem resolved in this particular case. It is simply not the time nor the place for it. That's my opinion.
Im not saying that demanding validation is the answer, I have dealt with this company, and im saying that they do employ some shady people, but believe it or not, they have some good people too. who work in the Front Offices, not the call center, but if the poster wants it to get deleted, they should be prepared to pay the fully charged off amount, They will settle They will retrieve a debt from a collection agency, if need be , for a PAID IN COLLECTIONS, notation. but a full deletion will require a FULL payment, I found out the hard way, as i have stated in many many many other posts, that if you know the debt is yours, it will take much longer to get it removed by forcing validation, and hoping for a violation. I understand that some people do not have the funds, if that is the case with the original poster, I recomend that the poster not call till they can pay it in full for a full deletion, because you will sign a legal release , upon agreeing upon a settlemnt and the terms.. at least in my case.
Thanks to all for your help, it's much appreciated. And thank you Bill for your quick response. I had no idea I was about to hang myself. The call and the letters I got from the collection attorney are not full of the usual anger, threats etc. In the two letters I have received (the first and the one with the "validation" he sent (not form letters either but do have mini miranda on them), in each he seem quite human, unlike most collectors, and requests that, "after my review,of the enclosed validation", to please call him and he will work with me insofar as negotiating a settlement or a payment plan regarding the account. Since the validation was done correctly as you stated above, and so far no violations, unless of course he puts it on my credit report or doesn't list as disputed, I wait a few weeks and contact him and try negotiating the best settlement I can for myself. I never anticipated walking away from this without paying, I just didn't want to to get further suckered by CCB since they can say the acct is for any amount they wanted to, and I'd have no proof of it.
to Sahlegian: Thanks for your help too. The problem I have with what you are suggesting is that, in January, I had full funds to settle with. Of course, I didn't know about this Board back then at all, and certainly did not speak with the President, as I said, I was lucky to get one of the "*****" to allow me to speak with a supervisor. I was told they would not take it back from NCO, they would not accept payments from me, etc. "I must deal with NCO" is all they'd say. Fine, tried to do that and freaking NCO vanished after I validated, and they only had the acct 1 month! I do not have the $3,004 at this time to pay CCB in full and get full deletion (which I think you were just really lucky and the Gods were standing over you that day!). Therefore, I think my best route is to either settle and get ironclad letter from new collector so that the balance of settlement difference isn't picked up by another collector, or even CCB, of if that's not possible and they won't settle, I will need them to allow monthly payments until Jan '04 when I would be able to pay it in full. If I don't settle with attorney/collector and just try to wait until next January to have the full amount and call CCB, I'm sure between now and then this collector will institue a suit. That's a chance I can't take. I cannot afford to be garnished and don't get too excited when I think of judgment either. But I do thank you very much for all you have suggested. In other circumstances, I'd certainly give it a try.
Ok. So now we are getting down to the real truth of what has happened. They sent it to NCO and you demanded validation of NCO and they sent it back to the OC and refused to collect. Now you are back at dealing with the OC. Now the OC has 2 choices. Try and collect on it or send it to another 3rd party collector or forget about collecting it. If they send it to an attorney then the attorney is still a 3rd party collector. You should most definitely wait them out. They will send it to another 3rd party collector and then you should demand validation all over again. So just be patient and let them do with it what they will. You can't easily deal with CCB if you don't have the funds to do so. So do the next best thing and just sit tight and wait them out. Believe me, if you don't have the funds now then you don't have much of any other choice. So just be quiet and do nothing at all until either you have the funds or they send it to another collector and then demand validation of that other 3rd party collector. Anything else you do will just be asking for problems you cannot handle.
bbaur IS 100 % correct, I have done a lot of research on this company before making a call , and never once have i heard of them suing anybody for that little amount, and after seeing how many FDCPA lawsuits, and Class Action lawsuits, they have had against them the last thing the legal dept wants is to face another judge, thats why the office of the president was formed, eventually it will get sent to Tate Kirlin Associates, who collects on behalf of CCB. they only take a % of whats collected, once they get it, you stand a decent chance of settling. but expect to see a lot of junk in the mean time. If your not gonna apply for credit for a while, just hang in there till you have the funds to pay them in full, They are a B@#@ i know, when you do call the number i gave ya, and start talking away. you will be suprised how far ya will get, this is not the Collections dept, but a special complaint dept, I dont see them suing you any time soon. they have bigger problems. IT takes time and persistance, but i think you can do it.
By the way, it was not 1 day the gods were next to me, it took over 2 months of negotiating with them and their executive correspondance dept to get it deleted. I had to sign a FULL 10 page legal release, and a confidentiality agreement. and send them the full amount by Certified Check, I had to let them pull a HARD inq on all 3 of my credit reports to let them see that I was not in trouble all over the place. And fianlly after all that they sent me the UDF's and deleted EXP, EXF, and finally 3 weeks ago TU. it was a TON of work, but well well well, worth the cost of prime credit, as i now have a Disney Visa, Amex, and a few dept store cards. and the SUB prime cards , sub prime interest rates and monthly fees are in the trash!!
Please Sahlegian, I never meant to downplay what you must have gone through and the duration of same in getting what you have achieved from CCB. I certainly take my hat of to you. I don't know that I would have had the perserverance and fortitude that you had. And to Bill: FYI. No, when the charged off the acct in 12/02, I then recv'd. only letter I got from NCO. Found these Boards in late January and with yours and many others help, validated with NCO. NCO apparently received my request for validation (got green card back) but then must have either sent back to OC and OC then sent it to Frederick Hanna, Esq. and associates (an attorney collection company in my hometown), or NCO passed it on to Hanna. I then validated with Hanna, which brings me to my first post on this thread. Again, I thank you all for stopping me from making an obviously HUGE mistake! I will sit tight and hope I can remain ungarnished until January, at which time I will employ Sahlegian's suggestions.
