I sent a val. letter to UCB collections in July for a medical bill. I got a letter typed from them a month later stating thay they have the name, address, SSN, place of employment, and signature of someone else that wasn't my name, but they could not send it to me due to federal regulations they must abide by, including FDCPA and HIPPA. they sent me, someone who they can't identify, the patients name and account #. The patient is my Daughter who lives in Maine. If they can't identify me, why would they include the patients name? Anyway. I sent an other letter outlining all their violations (never marked account in dispute on CR's) and gave them 10 days to delete. Got another letter from them yesterday.Not an original, but a photocopy. Pretty much states: the name we supplied to you several times in our first letter was a typo. At no time did this account ever belong to that person. I apologize for the problems this typo many have caused you. (Her typo again, not mine) All the research done by Mr. CA REP, MR. CA Vice President, and myself show you "CORRECT SPELLING OF MY NAME" are responsible for the bill. I have included a copy of the itemized bill to validate this debt. It gives some more crap about sending them documentation as to why I do not owe this bill, yada yada.. The itemized bill was for my daughter in January 2000. My daughter has not been back to see me since then, 3 years. The address stated on this account under patients name and address is my current address, not the one I lived in 3 years ago when I took her to the ER. AND they list my city right, but under state...they put the state the CA is located in... (OH). I have never lived in Ohio. I've moved 3 times since then, and I can prove it. The address I lived at when I sent the validation letter is the one they used, and I just moved again last month. Plus, the name they list under the parent or guardian is me, but the address is the current one too, not the one I lived at when I took her. I'm thinking about calling Health Alliance and asking them if they can supply me with this form they have on record. SHould I contact them so I can get proof from Health Alliance that this is forged? I hope this isn't confusing, I can elaborate more...I just need some guidance on which way to pursue this. It's only for $126, but if they have to forge documents, I think I should do something more
Umm you took your daughter to the ER. They treated her and you are unwilling to pay a $126 bill? I hope you never take this before a Judge. Have you offered payment for deletion? Even if they won't agree to that I would pay it. Wait for it to age and then dispute. Even if it sticks it isn't the end of the world.
pnw, just because he took his daughter to the ER doesn't show that *HE* is personally liable for the bill... That'ld be like someone getting taken to the ER in the amblance, and telling the billing department to send the bill to the amblance company because they are the ones who took them to the ER... Theres the question of insurance, was the daughter covered? did the insurance pay? did the hospital screw up the billing? However, the most important issue is the falsifying of the statement to show the current information. If the CA can put your current information on the validation statements, they've got carte blanche to falsify any statement. Section 807 (10) The use of any false representation or deceptive means to collect or attempt to collect any debt or to obtain information concerning a consumer. In response to a validation request, falsifying the validation to contain the current information instead of the original information would appear to fall under this prohibition. Validation requires the copies of the original documentation, not documentation that the CA decides to cook up, NOW... Was the validation on the OC's letterhead, or stationary, or was it printed off of the CA's computer system, or can you tell? The Wollman opinion states that "The statute requires that the debt collector obtain verification of the debt and mail it to the consumer (emphasis mine). Because one of the principal purposes of this Section is to help consumers who have been misidentified by the debt collector or who dispute the amount of the debt, it is important that the verification of the identity of the consumer and the amount of the debt be obtained directly from the creditor. Mere itemization of what the debt collector already has does not accomplish this purpose. As stated above, the statute requires the debt collector, not the creditor, to mail the verification to the consumer." http://www.ftc.gov/os/statutes/fdcpa/letters/wollman.htm In this case, validation would include copies of the ORIGINAL FORMS proving the information for the party whom is the RESPONSIBLE PARTY; with the correct contact information for the RESPONSIBLE PARTY, at that time. Because it is imperative under Wollman to prove that *HE* is the responsible party. Butch, or one of the other experts can correct me if I'm over simplifying this, or if I took anything the wrong way by mistake...
Barring unusual cirmcumstances taking your child to the ER you would be responsible. It isn't like it is a unknown third party. Get this before a judge and this will be the issue. It is likely the CA realizes that too.
Re: Re: CA forged medical papers for valida Actually, the unusual circumstance is that the parent is solely the responsible party... There are a lot of variables which are neccessary, #1 is insurance. #2 is the age of the daughter, is the daughter old enough that she is the RESPONSIBLE PARTY, #3 is the family status in the original posting it was mentioned that the daughter hasn't been back since then, if this is a situation involving divorce, or custody, it could be that the SPOUSE or EX-SPOUSE is the RESPONSIBLE PARTY, and not the poster. The poster didn't mention these issues, so YOU ARE ASSUMING; and you know what happens when YOU assume... However, these questions not witstanding, as far as the FDCPA is concerned the RELEVANT discussion is, WHETHER OR NOT THE CA VIOLATED THE FDCPA BY FORGING THE PARTIAL VALIDATION THAT THEY PROVIDED.
Re: Re: Re: CA forged medical papers for valida as far as the FDCPA is concerned the RELEVANT discussion is, WHETHER OR NOT THE CA VIOLATED THE FDCPA BY FORGING THE PARTIAL VALIDATION THAT THEY PROVIDED. ==================== Of cours it's a violation.
Re: Re: Re: CA forged medical papers for valida Assuming unusual cirmcumstance when none were mentioned would be the mistake. You know what assuming does when you do that, right? Weather or not a parent is legally obligated they are morally obligated. It isn't like we are talking about 100K here. It is just over $100. Come on guys lets keep a little balance. Again if you take it to small claims or state court the judge will see it as parent shirking their responsibility. The CA likely understands that.
Re: Re: Re: CA forged medical papers for valida One would be surprised at what an experienced attorney can get the courts to examine or thouroughly ignore. Be careful in what you post.
Re: Re: Re: CA forged medical papers for valida This bill SHOULD have been covered by my insurance...and it is ONLY $126. not enough to break the bank, but if they are forging documents, this isn't right. I just want to find out WHY my insurance wasn't billed for this and why it was turned over for collections.
Re: Re: Re: Re: CA forged medical papers for valida 1*Forgery is never rite. 2*Don't blame you . You have every right to have these questions answered befor any one has a right to demand payment.
Re: Re: Re: Re: CA forged medical papers for valida #1) Contact the insurance company, and find out whether they *DID* pay the bill, and if they did, if you can get a copy of the canceled payment... and IF not, and it was supposed to have been, if the bill wasn't payed because of an error in processing the claim BY THE PROVIDER... usually the insurance company's contracts with the provider has some type of clause saying if we don't pay you because you screw up the claim, neither us, or the consumer is liable for your mistake... Typical circumstances where this comes up is when the provider holds on to claims say more than six months before trying to process them, etc... Occasionally with insurance company claims, the payment gets tied up between the claim and the check gets cut, and the providers turns it over to a collection agency BEFORE the insurance company gets the payment to them, however for some reason they aren't as quick to let the bulldogs that they've contracted to know that they were already given their bone by the insurance company. If the insurance company can provide a canceled check duplicate to yourself, then I'ld take a copy of that to the provider, and force them to call off the CA, and to retract *ALL* documentation that they provided to the CA, and force them to recall the account as having been submitted in error...
Re: Re: Re: Re: CA forged medical papers for valida Assuming unusual cirmcumstance when none were mentioned would be the mistake. You know what assuming does when you do that, right? Weather or not a parent is legally obligated they are morally obligated. It isn't like we are talking about 100K here. It is just over $100. Come on guys lets keep a little balance. Again if you take it to small claims or state court the judge will see it as parent shirking their responsibility. 1*The CA likely understands that. pnwman =========== 1*Probably so; but the object here is teaching the CA that he has to obey the law! ! * THE END ** *** ** LB 59 """"```--~~~~~~~~~--```'""'''
