I thought I remembered reading that the envelope that a collection agency sends cannot refer to debt collection. Does this come under the heading, communicating to 3rd parties or something? Anyone have any case law on this, if it is, in fact, a violation?
I know I've seen something about this, but I'm having difficulty finding it, of course. Okay, this is what I think you want: Section 808(8) of the FDCPA states: (8) Using any language or symbol, other than the debt collector's address, on any envelope when communicating with a consumer by use of the mails or by telegram, except that a debt collector may use his business name if such name does not indicate that he is in the debt collection business. HTH
Way to go. Thank you! So, is this a violation that would be worthy of a lawsuit, or is it too minor (frivolous)? Thanks again.
yea, sue them for say 1.2 mil... why not! i mean geez... you owe the damn debt... pay the damn debt... everyone seems to be out to sue... they might have made a mistake... <ends rant>
Ouch. Someone must have woke up on the wrong side of the bed this morning. Allen, here is MY opinion on the "sue happy" population here on credit net. MORE POWER TO THEM. First, you do not know if he DOES owe the debt. He never suggested if it was owed or if he believed that it was not his. Second, Would you suggest that it be OK for them to continue OVER AND OVER AND OVER AND OVER again to break the law? Most consumers have NO IDEA what their rights are regarding credit. I at one time paid bills that were not mine just to get them to STOP calling me. Most credit reports have errors on them. Most of which are VERY hard to remove. I for one will NEVER pay anything for something that this not mine because I know my rights (this includes having bad credit for the next 7 years because someone made what you call a "mistake") If you broke the law everyday sometimes hundreds of times a day, would you expect to face the consequences? Don't tell me that they do not know that it is illegal to reference a debt on the envelope.
Hmmmm can't wait until Viking COLLECTION Service sends me another statement. Wished I'd saved the envelope. Sounds like it is an awfully gray area.
I wake up on the same side of the bed everyday... cant get on the other side cuz not enough room... my main issue is that it seems that a lot of people on this board will do anything they can to either sue someone or get out of paying what they owe. When you charge something, or get goods or services on credit, you owe the money. I was a public accountant (no jokes please) before becoming a web guy. I saw the amazing amounts of bad debt companies have to deal with. I owe over $15k in credit card debt and intend to pay every friggin dime even if i have to strip or pimp myself LOL. I still owe for trips i took in college 8 yrs ago. It disturbs me to understand how many people seem to be trying to get away without paying. Its like a lot of the people who file for BK. One day these people will have monies owed to them and I hope that the person who owes, defaults. Now of course there are legit issues. I understand. There are circumstances beyond our control. But when you know you owe it, you should do everything you can to pay the debt. Thanks, Allen
I actually agree that if you know you owe the money, you should pay it. BUT....... 1) If a CA has bought the debt for pennies, and the OC won't ever see the money I pay to the CA, I have issues with that. If I know the money will go to the OC, I have no problems paying, in full, even. 2) Just because I owe the money doesn't mean that they get to break the law in their attempts to get me to pay it. 3) There are a lot of people out there who DON'T know their rights under the FDCPA and FCRA, and every time that I just roll over and pay the money without making them adhere to the law, I'm making it worse for the next guy they try to collect from because it only adds to their arrogance. 4) If I make them obey the law, through a lawsuit or a settlement that includes deletion in exchange for me not suing them, it's possible I may have made the road a little less bumpy for that next guy because they may think twice before pulling the same tactics with him - in fear of reaching yet another educated consumer. JMNSHO. I'm not sue-happy, in fact, I've never even sent an intent-to-sue letter; I've been fortunate enough so far that I haven't had to. But if I had a CA trampling all over the rights that Congress gave me, you bet I'd be down at the Small Claims court to make them answer for their illegal actions. Completely OT, Allen, but I've thought your site ROCKS for quite a while now. I'm all for free scripts and such ;-)
Well, I think this is a horrible thing to say. Why would you wish something bad on someone else? Didn't your mama teach you the golden rule? Be nice! L (who believes having good manners is more important than having a lot of money)
Can't find anything, but I swear I *heard* that somewhere. Oh well, I guess I RETRACT my statement - Please Disregard.
Thanks waalien! I am glad you like it... I am not a bad person... I would love to see an honest thread where people openly say how many times they have tried to get away without paying the creditor. Remember, say you default with Citibank... now citibank has to make up for that some way... they cut jobs, they raise rates, lower service levels, etc.
Thanks everyone. This particular violation is interesting, because what's inside the envelope (information about a debt) isn't as relevant as what the company is telling the world about the existence of that debt on the outside of the envelope (maybe throw in libel, too?). I think the whole idea is that communication about the debt is a private matter, regardless of whether the debt is legitimately owed or not. So in that respect, it would probably be an easy one to go into court with, because the underlying debt shouldn't become an issue. It shouldn't anyway in most FDCPA lawsuits, but you always run the risk of getting a judge like Allen here.
I swear I also heard it was illegal. I remember being appalled at the car dealership that I used to work for last year when I looked into the outgoing mail box and saw all of these bills with a big red stamp saying PAST DUE on the front of the envelope. I almost wanted to run and report them or quit my job right there and then because they were being such scumbags, lol. I believe it is an invasion of a person privacy and personal affairs that he/she is PAST DUE on the outside of the envelope of any bill/statement. The only way it should be made known to others is if they themselves tell people or they file for bankruptcy and it becomes public record or I also guess if the creditor files suit against them and then it becomes public record as well.l
whats funny is that the playboy still comes in that baggie with a black cover like people dont know whats inside
2*i mean geez... you owe the damn debt... pay the damn debt... 3*they might have made a mistake... 1*<ends rant> allen074 ================ 1*Starting another 0ne. 2*Sounds just like Hawg. You two been comparing notes??? 3*Yep breaking the law was a mistake. >Termination of rant two.< [
Don't tell me that they do not know that it is illegal to reference a debt on the envelope. ---------------------- Ignorance of the law is no excuse .
lbrown59, Kindly refrain from misrepresenting my position(s). I do not condone companies breaking the law. Also, I know here are unscrupulous companies out there, just like individuals. Just because I feel someone is responsible for making good on a debt for goods or services used or consumed, that does not mean that others aren't held to the same standards. Problem is, the people who are trying to shaft companies are also in charge of companies trying to shaft the consumer. What goes around comes around. Hawg Hanner
You're beginning to sound more like Hawg than Hawg does. PARDON the PUN. but You two must be like two peas in a pod or is it two pigs in a pok.LOL
Regarding the dealership stamping "Past Due" on the envelope. The FDCPA prohibits this. The FDCPA only applies to collection agencies, not the original creditor. The OC can write "You are a scum sucking deadbeat" on the envelope if they want. So it was not illegal for the dealship to do that.
