Credit Check 4 Plane Tickets

well actually, counterterrism investigation would be the permissible purpose. A little known (and little discussed) tool for federal invstigators is the ability to secretly access your credit files if you are deemed a subject in an investigation that falls under the umbrella of "national security"---with a court order, of course.

Under this provision, federal agents can make their request to a federal magistrate who would then grant (or deny) their request. They (assume FBI but could be Customs, FinCEN, USSS etc) would then contact the CRAs and request a national security disclosure. When they hand over your report, they code your file so that the inquiry DOES NOT show anywhere on your reports--lest they subject be tipped off...

 

jonesing,

What section of the FCRA allows for counter-terrorism investigation?

I have read the provisons for national security investigations but it is still tied to employment purposes.

Is it listed somewhere else, maybe the Patriot Act?

Or, does the court order just function as an umbrella and specifics aren't listed?

Sassy

 

jonesing,

Thank you, I found it, I believe, Section 625 yes?

In part:

§ 625. Disclosures to FBI for counterintelligence purposes [15 U.S.C. § 1681u]

(a) Identity of financial institutions. Notwithstanding section 604 [§ 1681b] or any other provision of this title, a consumer reporting agency shall furnish to the Federal Bureau of Investigation the names and addresses of all financial institutions (as that term is defined in section 1101 of the Right to Financial Privacy Act of 1978 [12 U.S.C. § 3401]) at which a consumer maintains or has maintained an account, to the extent that information is in the files of the agency, when presented with a written request for that information, signed by the Director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation, or the Director's designee, which certifies compliance with this section. The Director or the Director's designee may make such a certification only if the Director or the Director's designee has determined in writing that

(1) such information is necessary for the conduct of an authorized foreign counterintelligence investigation; and

(2) there are specific and articulable facts giving reason to believe that the consumer

(A) is a foreign power (as defined in section 101 of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 [50 U.S.C. § 1801]) or a person who is not a United States person (as defined in such section 101) and is an official of a foreign power; or

(B) is an agent of a foreign power and is engaging or has engaged in an act of international terrorism (as that term is defined in section 101(c) of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 [50 U.S.C. § 1801(c)]) or clandestine intelligence activities that involve or may involve a violation of criminal statutes of the United States.

 

Hey Butch,

I think we keep the same hours, SNORT ;-)

I've never even heard of the FISA, but it darn sure is in the FCRA, 625, and it isn't specific to foreigners either!

Who posted above that we all could be terrorists, was it milkmom?

She was spot on.

Read that section and post what you think please while burning that midnight oil.

Sassy

 

I have to disagree with the whole concept. It is just another way for Big Brother to control us. It is going to come to a point where we will live and die by our credit reports (if it hasn't happened already).

Plus, by looking at one's credit report how do they determine if one is a terrorist? Last time I checked Middle Eastern banks did not report on American credit reports. Also, most terrorists do not use credit. Why would they? Credit is traceable, cash isn't.

My favorite is that the TSA somehow wants to establish this. Isn't this the same company that is suppose to have new federal security agents (and screeners) in place by November of this year and so far they they have hired screeners and agents at only six of the required 100+ national airports?

In my eyes, flying is becoming unsafer everyday. Staying at home is starting to look more appetizing.

Dani

 

re McCarthyism and terrorism: I think you are comparing apples and oranges.

 

FISA was enacted to protect the people from the FBI by defining its boundaries. Prior to FISA the FBI and CIA had routinely and illegally engaged in harrassing, following, and otherwise disrupting the lives and careers of law-abiding citizens.

Despite Bush's latest actions, the CIA will remain an independent entity, accountable only to itself. Bush had intended to bring the FBI under the auspices of the new dept of Homeland Security, but his advisers (I wonder why!) shot down that idea.

This is the latest ruse to enlarge government's control of our daily lives. Why do we need this new department when we already have: The Justice dept (includes the FBI), the CIA, the Defense dept?

We're told it will consolidate resources?! Yeah, right. Neil Cavuto (Fox News Channel) compared it to someone entering a debt consolidation program, but only ending up with large debts again.

Wake up, people. Do you really think Afghanistan is a barren, good-for-nothing land? Do you appreciate its logistical importance to the oil trade?

Why is our military deployed in some 144 countries around the world? Who do you think trained/helped Ussamah Bin Laden, Manuel Noriega, the Sandinistas, the Shah of Iran, Saddam Hussein, etc. before they became bad guys?

 

Itself and the members of the Senate Select Committe for Intelligence. Or at least those few members that it figures are favorable to them ;-)

But not only CIA, look at NRO--they built a *huge* new operations/hq building right under the noses of congress and nobody knew! It wasn't until someone dropped a dime that congress started looking into this new billion dollar facility going up in their back yard. And when they were called on the carpet about it, a senior NRO officer explained that they were indeed cutting the cost down--the health club, for example was only 1/2 the size they had originally planned! LMAO

 

Rina, you took the words right out of my mouth!!

 

milkmom,

I was about to say those same words after I read your post; then all this subterfugde got my gander up, as the old folks say. And I just had to flesh out my thoughts.

Oracle's CEO was right - there's no such thing as privacy.

This is politics as usual. We always have a "moral obligation" to tell other nations what to do, up to and including invading them. How many times have we been wrong (i.e. slavery & segregation); why wasn't there a "moral world leader" at that time to invade the US?

Whenever a dissenter brings up the domestic and foreign policy bungles of the US, the spin doctors say, Oh, but the FBI is doing better now; in fact we just gave them a raise! Oh, but we don't persecute Japanese people anymore. Oh, but we don't secretly experiment on Black men anymore. I shudder to think what they are doing now. Why is it that only the US, Russia, Israel & Great Britain can be trusted to have untold numbers of nuclear warheads?

Now the gloves have come off, and our officials can once again "get down & dirty", spread propaganda and misinformation through the office of strategic influence. Just because they said they got rid of it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist under another name.

 

Sorry Butch,

I went to bed, sleep happens some nights ;-)

FCRA, Section 625, Disclosures to FBI for counterintelligence purposes [15 U.S.C. § 1681u]

It's the very last section, I suspect most of us stop reading before this part as it never seems applicable.

http://www.ftc.gov/os/statutes/fcra.htm#625

Whether any of us like it or not and I'm nodding along as in previous posts, I don't. BUT, as jonesing pointed out, they can and already do this.

After reading the FCRA section, you'll see the part about the disclosure exemption too, thus no inquiry, you'll never know. We are all potential terrorists and have been -- just didn't know about it.

As I understand it now, the checking at airports would only allow someone other than the FBI to perform the check, or someone "affiliated" with the FBI that could operate under that existing purpose.

Affiliated is getting to be a key word these days :-(

Sassy

 

Sassy, Was "Father Knows Best" prime time? I only saw the reruns. Charlie In the good ole days, a prank used to be midnight toiletpapering someone's front yard and running around your car before the light turned green ;-) Sassy

 

Sorry, That previous post didn't come out right. Charlie

 

sorrrrrrrrrryyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy charlie,

LOL, you aren't implying that I'm aged are ya?

Sassy

 

Butch,

I wasn't around in 1933, don't tell charlie though ;-)

FDR and his declarations aside, President Bush declared war and a national state of emergency, I don't believe he's rescinded those.

I REALLY take exception to the Federal Government can do any damn thing it wants so get over it -- I think that's the most dangerous attitude we can have.

I don't think this issue is separate from credit issues either, they go together, privacy and our right to privacy is and was a foundation of this country and its citizens.

We may all be viewed as potential terrorists and the reality may very well be that the government can do whatever it wants -- I don't intend to get over it and I hope no one else does either.

KNOWING how it operates and how we as individuals function within the great it, makes a huge difference in the preservation of our rights, exercising them, or like in the equifax medical thread, knowing what the system consists of so we can function as people within a system without being deprived of our needs. This is still a nation and government made up of people, afterall.

Sassy