Proof that Fico is stacked against us. I recently wrote that I had reached 800 on my scores. As of 10/31, that was still true. Checked my FICO again this morning, and my score has dropped over 40 points, FOR NO REASON. I have no new cards. I have no new inquiries. I have no new debt. As a matter of fact, I can not see any difference. Last month, Fico said:Negative Factors Because your FICO score is exceptionally high, there are no actionable negative factors present with your score. Continue to manage your credit as you currently are doing to maintain your very high FICO score. 2 weeks later: Negative Factors Here are the top factors where you have the most opportunity to take action that will increase your FICO score over time (they are listed in priority of impact on your score): You have too many bankcard charge accounts Here's my theory. I believe that FICO does reward you for paying down debt. But I also think the scoring model wants to see activity. So now that I have paid it all down, they want to see me owe more again. Bottom line. Every time I think I have this wired, I get thrown for another loop. I'm going to keep plugging away and I'll let you know my results. Stay tuned.
I think you are so right. Then when you add the "games" creditors play - we really lose. I have 4 accounts that have been paid off since September, but none of those creditors have updated. My score has dropped 26 points as a result. I'm afraid to dispute the accounts to force them to update - the last time I did that, the creditor did not update, they just placed the account "in dispute" - now I can't get that notation removed. You can't win. The "accurate snapshot" of my credit at a given point in time does not exist.
Is it just me or does it seem to you too that some creditors are VERY quick to report when a balance goes UP, but very slow to report when it goes down? Citi and our local bank are the two that have been the worst offenders in our case. And I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment of the "accurate snapshot". It does not exist. DemPooches
I agree...and whatever you do, don't dispute your old tradelines. I had one from JCP that was from 1990 but was listed as inactive. I disputed it as closed by consumer and they simply deleted it...royally screwing up my average age of accounts and dropping my score by 20 points. Grrrrrr! L
It's not just you. I have noticed it, and others have commented on it here. One amusing thing out of all this, though... I was imagining last night how much Fair Isaac and creditors must hate having to deal with our displeasure over their manipulations of our scores. Many many consumers are aware now of the tricks and games being played. One of my friends, who is not a credit junkie, told me he had closed his CapOne Miles One card, because he realized how much it was hurting his score. For years these games were being played and we never even knew it. Now we know and we here on creditnet are not the only ones reacting, hehe. I understand Citi has been deluged with complaints about their reporting inconsistencies. They finally started reporting the limits on EXP. And credit appications are wayyyyyyy down. People no longer accept every spiffy-looking offer they get in the mail, because they know how bad their scores will suffer. No wonder Fair Isaac didn't want to divulge their "formula." For now I think it's best just to take all this into account, and plan ahead. That's all I've been able to accomplish. But I believe that public reaction and outcry will eventually force some changes.
I have a household mc with a $1500 limit that was opened in may02. I pay it down considerably every month that I use it. One month I charged the account close to the limit. But, I paid $900 bringing it down to a little over $600 with the added interest. I paid this 1 week before the closing date. They reported the me over the limit by $3.00 which has remained on my report since sept. My balance is only $400 now but they haven't updated at all. My score was 614 and now 596 on EQ. Reason is of course high utilization of credit.
And I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment of the "accurate snapshot". It does not exist. DemPooches ================If you can't win get out of the game.
But I believe that public reaction and outcry will eventually force some changes. breeze ------------------------------------------ If this is what you beleive then why in the H*** try to hush the out cry by putting the voice on ignore. =========== I couldn't say I told you so now could I?
Breeze and Pooches-- You are absolutely right. I have been tinkering and playing with my scores with a deranged passion, but it definitely seems like one step forward, two steps backward. I truly thought I had it figured out, but this latest point loss perplexes me. I am afraid that I have been letting the FACO scores influence me too much, but I am beginning to realize that while they hugely reward you for having zero debt, the "real" Ficos want to see more activity. TransUnion is a perfect example. The FACO says I am nearly perfect, but the real one is about the same as my Equifax score. I do understand now why the bureaus fought so hard against us learning our scores.
Even with the drop you would still be around 760 which is in the perfect range. Would anyone turn you down for any prime loan in that range? Why not use the cards for your everyday needs and then pay it off each month? That would boost you back up since they would see activity.
I apologize if I am making too big a deal about this. You are right about my score. It just really irks me that the system has no rhyme or reason. Why should my score have dropped so significantly when nothing changed? The problem isn't the score I have now, but the implications. If nothing can make my score drop 43 points, then how about something? What credit behavior occured in the last 2 weeks that took me down from the top percent of consumers to the 70th percentile? It's a faulty system.
Calypso, I don't think you have ANYTHING to apologize for! If you can't talk about something like this on a credit board, then where? IMO, This type of experience only helps the rest of us who wonder about it anyway. How will we ever make heads or tails of it if we don't share what we know? Who knows, maybe someday we WILL figure it out! LOL! Newstdt
Is that notation from Citibank? They seem quick to put that on there and then it's hard to get them to remove it. They haven't updated my accts since the summer and I am afraid to dispute for the same reason b/c they did this to me when they didn't update from April to July. They make it look like I owe them all kinds of money when I have been paying my balances w/ them in full every month. And they happen to have gotten stuck at particularly high balances for me.
Yep, it's Citibank. They're doing it to others too? I should have known I wasn't the only one. It's just that no one else has posted anything about it. I posted it several times. I wonder what you have to do to get them to take it off?
Calypso, Le me add another actual example of "Fico"madness 11/12 Fico 791 11/13 Fico 746 11/15 Fico 802 Amex reported on 11/13 a $14K balance due, actual balance due = $0 - (It is paid in full - It's a Amex card you Fico idiots). Score plummets 50 points. On 11/14 I did an online dispute as "incorrect balance". On 11/15 my score was back up. EQ still showns the 14k balance, but disputing it has pushed my score back up (even higher that before)! This is crazy to gain and lose 50 points overnite. I'm sure Amex will report the correct balance later and everything will be fine. But this is nuts! The above does show that disputed items are not calculated in the EQ Fico score. And if I weren't a CreditNet junky, I would have let it correct itself next month. This is also why I just got the Amex OPEN business card and an OPEN LOC. The 14k was business expenses for this month and now will be off my personal credit report, but one good aspect is that now my "high credit - credit limit" on Amex is 14k and will help my ratios when I only have a 2 or 3k balance. It's a crazy game but it is kind of fun to play, I got to join the 800 Club again!!!! Who knows for how long? JohnM
I wish I knew. I have called Citibank CS a few times and if I don't get someone who is too confused to understand what I am talking about, I hear that they can't see why that statement would be on there. EQ told me that it's there "for my protection" and EX told me they can't remove it, only the creditor can. I forget what TU said but something equally nonsensical. I must have missed your posts on the subject or I would have definitely chimed in! I almost feel like Citibank punishes you for trying to force an update but maybe I am just frustrated w/ them.
I know! Other than this, I have been very happy with Citi. They do update on EFX and TU, just not on EXP, and that may be EXP's fault. Maybe I will send them a printout of my report for november showing the Aug info and see what they do.
The printout idea is a good one. And it's true their updates lag the most on EX. They fall somewhat behind on my TU but not as bad. Probably is EX but try to get EX to admit it.
