My EXP and TU credit reports are virtually identical. The only difference is that EXP is better about tracking my old accounts than TU so I have more of them on there. However, they are all 1) closed 2) installment accts. So they really shouldn't have much impact on a score. But here's the weird part. With TU, my top positive factor is that I have a long credit history. With EXP? My top NEGATIVE factor is that I have a short history. And since the FICO on score with EXP doesn't give you your positive info. or any explanation under your negative factors (such as "your oldest account is only X years old") I have no way of knowing what's going on. Anyone have any ideas? I initially thought that my average age of open accts. is different.... but the number of open accts. I have is identical. I'm really stumped.... and the difference in scores is significant.
Don't be stumped - there is no rhyme or reason to FICO. My FICO lists an 18 year credit history as a NEGATIVE - ideal should be 30 years!!!! Between the 3 bureaus I have FICO stating something as a positive on one bureau, the same thing is a negative on another and isn't mentioned on the 3rd. They have to list something to justify charging you - they didn't guarantee it would be consistent or make any sense.
I'm convinced the fico scoring programs at the three different bureaus are very different and will in fact give different scores for the same credit reports. Which is just further proof that FICO IS FAKO.
but that's the weird thing... my FAKO is 40 points higher than my FICO. I've put in a call to the FICO people and should get a call back sometime this wekk. Will let you know what they say.
I called the FICO and the first person I spoke with couldn't give me the specifics but did give me the following: "each of the bureaus values the things in your accounts differently. So what may be particularly positive for one bureau may not matter much to another one and vice versa." So if anyone ever needed the proof, there it is. You could have identical information on all three bureaus and your scores would be quite different -- not b/c there's an RNG but simply b/c the equations are different. I guess that intuititvely makes sense b/c, after all, the scores have all different names. I'll post again once I get a more thorough explanation.
I believe you just have to look at the list of reason codes for the three bureaus and you can tell they don't match. Furthermore the FICO scores are readjusted periodically based on how different consumers perform (got this from an advertisement for BEACOn). I just recently had my equifax score drop by forty points, with NO change in my credit file, and all of a sudden my new reason code is the number of credit cards I have. So, people like me defaulted a lot recently and having a number of credit cards seemed to be the cause.
Victims of Credit Reporting - Credit Scores http://members.aol.com/victcrdrpt/Score.html http://members.aol.com/victcrdrpt/Score.html
Spoke to a very nice lady from Fair-Isaac. A very competent woman who knew exactly what I was talking about and had actually researched my file thoroughly. What she told me about the scores confirms what a lot of you have been suggesting. Basically, there is not a single FICO score for everyone. The algorithm is so complex and detailed that it sub-classifies you into different categories based upon the content of your credit score. So there might be a category for those who have no serious delinquencies on the accounts, who are never more than 60 days late, etc. Each of the subcategories has its own formula for determining your score. And within these subcategories different aspects of your file are valued differently. So, for example, if you have a judgment on your TU report but not on your EQU and EXP reports, not only will your scores be radically different but your negative factors will change too. One of those is length of history -- if you have a history of not paying bills on time they don't care nearly as much for how long your accounts were open. That is, you'd have to have a VERY long history in order to have it count as a positive factor if there are major baddies on the account. It kinda makes sense -- a long credit history with no late payments is pretty impressive. A long credit history with late payment really isn't anything special. This is one of the reasons why there are such large score fluctuations when people are fixing their credit (not b/c it's an RNG). As you take things off your reports and put them back on you keep switching between sub-classifications and different parts of your report are valued differently. Also, the lady told me that, in so many words, FAKO is basically a sham. She laughed when I said it b/c she said that's exactly what it is: a fake score. She said one shouldn't put too much faith into it at all b/c it just simply doesn't have nuances to predict the FICO score correctly. So whatever you get from CreditExpert may or may not be close to your score. Mine isn't -- it's actually 100+ points off. One final note: she told me that the idea that the bureaus score differently is a myth b/c the differences are so incredibly slight that it simply doesn't matter. She said that if a consumer has three identical reports the scores will all be within 5-10 points of each other.
excuse my ignorance but does that mean that you can only rely on scores provided by Fair Issac? (www.myfico.com) Alex
I agree with most everything you say, except the last statement that all three of the bureaus score the same. I have a credit report where someone only had one account on it, all reported the same and her scores were 781, 762,and 717. The only that could have been different on the accounts would be the number of inquiries(which for some reason the trimerge doesn't show). I have a hard time believing a 64 point difference caused by inquiries only. We'll have to see if we can find some credit report with all three EXACTLY the same to check it out.
No, the lady was making the point that FICO is THE score, FAKO scores are wannabees. Surprising she made that point, eh ? You can also get your FICO scores direct from TU and EQ.
I STILL THINK IT IS RNG (MY OPINION) How else do you explain NO BADDIES EVER...but take a MAJOR score "HIT" with a payment >$30,000 (NOT A BT)...HOW DO EXPLAIN THAT I OWED TENS OF THOUSANDS LESS WITH 665 THAN I DID WITH 739...
Croft So let me get this straight for once and all.... lol - sorry but here I go. So called Fico scores which one can obtain directly from the credit bureaus correct? Fako are lets say: privacyguard truecredit and so on? Am I making the proper assesment?
Aaaack !!! LOLOLOL !!! Snort, Gasp.......LOLOLOLOL !!! Not a very likely premise is it ??? Taken at face value, I believe what she says. But the whole scenario that 3 CRAs would give you identical reports is just BEYOND RIDICULOUS ! That unlikelihood is the MAJOR reason why your FICO score from each of the 3 CRA's is different !!! LOLOL !
Re: Re: here's a FICO puzzle... Not entirely. Realize that FICO refers to a proprietary and trademarked set of equations, the rights to make use of which are owned and sold by Fair Isaac. Fair Isaac sells them directly to us through their myFICO.com web site. TU and EQ also buy the rights from Fair Isaac to resell the scores to us at THEIR web sites. A competitor set of equations out there is called CreditXpert and is sold by Experian. The CreditXpert set of equations is the source of the FAKO scores you can buy at TrueCredit and at Privacy Guard. There are other FAKO score sources which are even less credible. Whenever you buy a score, if the product description does not bear the trademark "FICO", it's FAKO ! So, to complete the answer to your question, you CANNOT (as of today) buy a FICO score based on your EX file at the EX web-site, probably because of the conflict of interest with their CreditXpert FAKO score they want to sell you. You can get your FICO score based on what's in your EQ file at EQ's web site. You can get your FICO score based on what's in your TU file at TU's web shite. BUT, be careful that you buy what's exlicitly called FICO there, NOT their FAKO "Personal Credit Score" !
Re: Re: here's a FICO puzzle... Thank you! - This one needs to go in the FAQ section. It is a must read if you want to really make educated decisions about credit. Thanks again croft. This is the kinda info you gotta normally pay for..lol No wonder the board has enemies. Gotta love America.. alex
Due to the following you can't rely on Fair Issac either. SCORING It's all a scam. http://members.aol.com/victcrdrpt/Score.html
Thanks for the link LBROWN. Very interesting and informative. So when a lender pulls your credit the score, what they get is based on the model used by that entity(CRA in most cases)? If so the trick is knowing who they use, but there would still be nothing you could do to make a difference. As I have read some of us here have variances of up to 100 points between Fico and Fakos.. Wow... I bet they never intended for us to learn this much. lol
