Last month I disputed an account with a CA (Arrow Financial Services). I haven't received the new report, but am almost certain it was removed. Now I have received a letter from Glove Law Office for the EXACT same account. What should my next step be? I keep reading about validation letters and some people say long, some say short. Could someone give me an example of what to say to get this taken care of hopefully before they even put it on my reports? Oh..I just noticed they are called First American Investment Company LLC. Advise please....
I believe it is not owed. I am almost certain this is one of the debts we had to pay off when we refinanced our home Dec 2001. It seems like this new CA is just reporting because the old one is getting removed per the dispute. How do you stop new CAs from appearing everytime the old one is removed?
Is it okay to say this: Dear Sirs: This is a response to your letter dated 08/01/2006? I am disputing this account and request that you send validation of this account. Please include original creditor, amount owed, payment history and any other relevant information to prove validity of this account. I look forward to hearing from you WITHIN 30 days. Thanks, Your Name
If the account was paid, no new CA should have it. What docs do you have on the payment? Can you get a copy of the check from the title company, if it was paid thru escrow? Your letter looks fine. Simple and direct. Send CRRR, so you have proof of delivery. They may choose not to respond in 30 days, or ever, of course. On their receipt, you would want to dispute thru the CRAs reporting it. What you want to get is willful or negligent erroneous reporting, with real or statutory damages under FCRA, and possibly continued collection on an unvalidated debt disputed timely, under FDCPA. That is your leverage to force removal. You don't just want "Oh, we'll just mark it "paid collection", you want them to want to remove it as part of a settlement. Get your records in order, particularly proof of payment, should you need to sue.
I don't have anything, but on my TU report dated 01/28/04 it says pd off 3/02. Now on the TU report dated 07/17/2006 it says purchased by another lender, but the status says 120 days past due. It says closed on 08/2002, date paid 03/2002.
That confirms your memory, since it says the CA or OC reporting at that time responded to your payment. Was payment made by your personal check, or via the title company?
...must have been the title company we used then. I remember them saying we HAD to pay it off and I don't remember doing it personally. Is the letter I posted earlier okay to send to them...or should I change it?
"Last month I disputed an account with a CA (Arrow Financial Services)." Was this based on a collection attempt by Arrow? Were you disputing and requesting validation from Arrow, or were you disputing an account reported by Arrow on your CR thru the CRA? Was this letter the first letter you received from Glove Law on this matter? Did it include the FDCPA required notice of your right to dispute and request validation, and that if you did not do so in 30 days, they would assume it was valid? I would make this change: "This is a response to your letter dated 08/01/2006, which I received on xx/xx/xxxx." I would leave out: "I look forward to hearing from you WITHIN 30 days." They may respond in less than 30 days, or they may ignore you, but if they continue collection including posting anything on your credit reports, without sending validation, or if they misrepresent that the debt is owed when it was paid, they will hear from you. I would attach (staple) a copy of the letter they sent, to indicate what account you are referring to. At the bottom of your letter, add: "Attached: letter from Glove Law, dated 08/01/2006" Send CRRR, keep a copy of everything you sent, staple your P.O. Certified receipt to your copy, print out the post office web site delivery notice, and staple it with your returned green card to your copy of what was sent. Some people note at the bottom of their certified letters something like: "Sent Certified, No. ####-####-####-####-####", using the number off the Certified slip they will put on the envelope that will contain the letter. Pick up a handfull of blank slips when you go to the post office. Get used to being systematic. If you have already paid this years ago, you want to stop the shell game and resolve it once and for all. If you have to go to court, you want your records in order.
Arrow has been on my report for a while and I was disputing through all CRAs to get it removed. This is the first letter I have received from Glove. Thanks for the changes. I will make them and get this in the mail. Thanks again for all the assistance on this board...you guys are GREEEEAAAAATTT!!!
Ok...thanks for all your previous help...and here I am again. I received a letter in the mail today from First American Investment Co LLC. It is as follows: Affidavit of Indebtedness State of New York ) County of Erie ) ss. Harvey Denis, being sworn, deposes and says that he is Vice President of First American Investment Company, LLC, herin called assignor, which is doing business at 400 Linden Oaks, Rochester, New York 14625 and that he is authorized to make the statements and representations herein. There is due and payable from ______, account number ______, the amount of $_______ (principal balance in the amount of $_____ plus interest from xx/2002 through 08/2006 in the amount of $_____). By the terms of the agreement between defendant and the original creditor, interest is accruing from the aforesaid date at the rate of 10 percent per annum. This account was originated with BANK ONE, and is now owed to First American Investment Company, LLC. Said account has been assigned, transferred and set over unto, Giove Law Office, PC, with full power and authority to do and perform all acts necessary for the collection, settlement, adjustment, compromise or satisfaction of said claim. This is the letter exactly as I have it...and yes they have Giove (should be Glove). Am I supposed to consider this a validation? What would you suggest my next step be? It's signed and dated and notarized. Any suggestions would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks in advance for all your help.
Quote: "Dear Sirs: This is a response to your letter dated 08/01/2006? I am disputing this account and request that you send validation of this account. Please include original creditor, amount owed, payment history and any other relevant information to prove validity of this account. I look forward to hearing from you WITHIN 30 days. Thanks, Your Name" Looks like this is exactly what was answered, if this was the letter sent. I would ask for a signed contract.
This is the letter I sent: This is a response to your letter dated 08/01/2006, which I received on 08/07/2006. I am disputing your claim and request that you send validation of this account pursuant to the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act. Please be advised that I am NOT requesting "verification", but "validation" (complete, competent evidence) that I have some contractual obligation to pay you. When sending proof of validation, please include original creditor, amount owed, payment history and any other relevant information to prove validity of this account. Your failure to satisfy this request within the requirements of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act will be construed as your absolute waiver of any and all claims against me, and your tacit agreement to compensate me for costs and attorney fees. Sincerely
"Your failure to satisfy this request within the requirements of the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act will be construed as your absolute waiver of any and all claims against me, and your tacit agreement to compensate me for costs and attorney fees." Pretty meaningless, since non-response does not bind an agreement. Just looks like you got the letter off the web. You look like an unsophisticated consumer who can be scammed. But the rest of the letter is a dispute/validation request, so it should meet the legal requirements. Did you send it CRRR, and keep a copy? As you would expect from Giove (check it, it is probably Giove, not Glove.), their response is bogus. Their own employee's affidavit has no bearing on validation of the original debt or the original creditor's records. It would not be admissible since it is at best hearsay, but they know that. And they probably sent you nothing obtained directly from the original creditor, in which case it is not only not validation, but either a deceptive letter sent as validation, or if sent as their first letter that included your FDCPA dispute and validation rights, a deceptive affidavit overshadowing that notification of your rights. If this is your first contact letter from Giove, it should have notified you of your dispute/validation rights. If you did not send your dispute/validation request to Giove, then send it now, and send it CRRR.
"It seems like this new CA is just reporting because the old one is getting removed per the dispute." It's cheaper to pass the alleged debt around than to validate. It also ensures they never risk finding out a debt is invalid. "How do you stop new CAs from appearing everytime the old one is removed?" You find a reason to sue them.
This is my second contact from Glove. The first was the letter dated 08/01/2006 to which I responded with my request for validation. They responded with the letter I received on 08/28/2006 which they are "calling" validation. They did include FDCPA dispute and validation rights on the back of the first contact letter. So for my next step.... should I write them again and say I received their verification letter and ask for validation again? As of today I have received updated reports from 2 bureaus (Transunion and CSC) and they are not listed on either one.
What did their alleged validation response include? Did it include anything obtained directly from the original creditor? When you originally paid this debt in 2001, who was the check made out to? When did the account originally go delinquent? What is SOL in your state for this type of debt?
What did their alleged validation response include? Did it include anything obtained directly from the original creditor? This is the letter I received...word for word from them....this is the only thing they sent. Affidavit of Indebtedness State of New York ) County of Erie ) ss. Harvey Denis, being sworn, deposes and says that he is Vice President of First American Investment Company, LLC, herin called assignor, which is doing business at 400 Linden Oaks, Rochester, New York 14625 and that he is authorized to make the statements and representations herein. There is due and payable from ______, account number ______, the amount of $_______ (principal balance in the amount of $_____ plus interest from xx/2002 through 08/2006 in the amount of $_____). By the terms of the agreement between defendant and the original creditor, interest is accruing from the aforesaid date at the rate of 10 percent per annum. This account was originated with BANK ONE, and is now owed to First American Investment Company, LLC. Said account has been assigned, transferred and set over unto, Giove Law Office, PC, with full power and authority to do and perform all acts necessary for the collection, settlement, adjustment, compromise or satisfaction of said claim. When you originally paid this debt in 2001, who was the check made out to? My spouse thinks this is one that was paid when we refinanced our house and the checks were part of closing...that's all I remember. When did the account originally go delinquent? ...kind of hard to tell, but this is the line from the oc 02/2004 09/2002 08/2002 07/2002 06/2002 05/2002 11/2001 08/2001 4 ------4-------- 4--------3--------2--------1--------1-------2 What is SOL in your state for this type of debt? 4 yrs....it's past
The OC is still reporting it as unpaid? You already know what type of debt collector you are dealing with, and what sort of BS they will fabricate. What they replied with is not validation, and this on a debt you already paid. If they had in fact validated, they would likely have found that the debt had already been paid. Bank One was bought by Chase: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank_One If they had obtained validation, they would have had to obtain it from Chase, assuming it was already delinquent when it was sold off. Although you know you already paid it, they might cause you enough credit damage to make it worth your while taking them to court. Since you would want them to cover the costs of doing that, including your own attorney's fees, you might need to prove the debt was already paid to strengthen your claim that their erroneous collection, including their deceptive "validation", should make them liable for substantial damages. Have you checked with the title company that wrote the checks from escrow? You might want to run this by an attorney with expertise in FDCPA and FCRA law in your state. See, for example: www.naca.net You might also want to check whether Giove Law Office is allowed to collect debts in your state.
OC is reporting pd 03/2002...and where would I look to see if Glove Law Office (First American Investment Company) is allowed to collect debts in TX.
