quote: I'm a lender, and I've seen people who've never been late with crap scores On time is just half of it David. If somebody just has just one credit card account that is maxed out and is only 6 months old and has 8 inquiries, they may be on time but of course the score is going to be rotten and justifiably so. That profile would probably present quite a risk. quote: and I've seen people who couldn't pay their bills responsibly if their own mother's lives depended on it with good scores. People with recent charge-offs just dont have good scores. Please clarify. Do these people have multiple 30 day late payments? What is their level of delinquency? # of accounts late how late oldest delinquency date
so it is possible with a 596! well i requested balance transfers i wonder if this will increase my odds?
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Ok, let's see where we stand© We have a MBNA credit analyst who is kind enough to visit the board every now and then and answer people's questions© He was trying to make a point, saying MBNA uses manual consideration as opposed to exclusively employing FICO-based algorithms© He brought up the "590 score" application as an example, suggesting that analysts' discretion is real, and score is only one factor among many© Then, all the self-proclaimed wiseguys start to question whether he's telling the truth© This is exacly the kind of behavior that made Jason ¥from Amex¤ And "Citibank rep", both regulars on the board, leave this place© Some of the excellent advice we've received from these two was worth its weight in gold© Now they're gone, and when another bank's rep is trying to be nice and is taking the time to respond to people's questions, we have these wiseguys trying to discredit him© Way to go© Saar
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat My understanding of mbna from these messages and this person: If you've screwed anyone but medical collections, don't waste your time. Even with medical collections, you better have a good excuse, and other good credit to back you up. Balance ratio is important, as is a well established credit file (years). Basically, mbna has pretty strict credit policies, much stricter than AMEX, Citi, etc... Strict in the sense "If you screwed someone before and its on your file, no dice". Thats reasonable for any company, and their policy is more STRICT than say, Citibank. Hell I got a citibank AA silver with 590's score and several collection/charge-off's (all non-medical).
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Big Beacon, Unless you are a lender with years of experience - you have no reason to question the truth of either David or Rubyjean when they say that "good" credit reports can garner low scores (and vice versa). I definitely believe both of them and am THANKFUL that Rubyjean has shared information and guidance on this board. Anybody who spends a huge amount of time 1.) approving applications (translate David, Rubyjean) or 2.) studying credit files from thousands of people (translate Christine at www.bayhouse.com) will tell you that there are surprising variances in FICO scores and credit files. Rubyjean merely shared what *she* saw on one credit profile and subsequently approved. She has no reason to lie. Please don't discourage her posting here by effectively calling her a liar. You really should spend some time reading the www.bayhouse.com forum (and archived forum) to read all the posts discussing FICO variations and changes. Christine has dedicated a lot of time to studying FICO, particularly how it changes drastically for no good reason. Frankly, reading CreditNet long enough will lead you to postings here and there of inexplicable FICO changes. where's lbbrown when you need him???
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat My browser is the one deciding which character coding I'll be using today. Hence the copyright signs in my above post. I'm not being possessive Saar
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Quote: Unless you are a lender with years of experience - you have no reason to question the truth of either David or Rubyjean when they say that "good" credit reports can garner low scores First, I did not post anything that would discredit David, I was just trying to clarify that being on time is not the only factor in obtaining a good Beacon score and I also want to clarify what he meant by "people that can't pay their bills responsibly" so that his input could be further understood by the forum. I dont want anybody who has been diligently working on their score to be discouraged by thinking that their chances of approval are like winning a raffle. Overall, the system is pretty accurate. Although there may be some flaws, the problem that generated a score fluctiation can generally be detected when examined closely such as improperly coded inquiries and accounts, improper dates, limit not reporting, etc. Quote: You really should spend some time reading the www.bayhouse.com forum I have been following Bayhouse for 3 years. If you frequent Bayhouse you should have seen some of my recent threads such as " HERE IT IS! Quarter Million in Credit Cards, Inquiries, Limits, and Scores" I recenly applied /was approved for over 20 cards with a score of 775 for a total line of $256,000 and posted the eq score and approved line after each apllication. I spend a couple of hundred bucks on credit reports. Not for my benefit but for the benefit of the members. I have 5+ years experience with Beacon/Empirica scoring. I have helped many people refinance homes from 8-10% or higher to around 6% not to mention car loans and credit cards saving them thousands of dollars. Many of these people had a perfect payment history but still were in the low 6s because they were maxed. I got them a secured loan from an outside source which moved the money off their credit, then moved it back on with prime interest rates rates. Let me clarify something. As I may seem harsh at times, I am not trying to discourage lenders from posting and I encourage their input and thank Ruby Jean for her time. On the other hand I will not tell people what they want to hear but I will state the facts beacause that is what the forum needs and will help people. Although I am not 100% accurate all the time I am quite educated in this field. If there is I time when I am wrong, I invite the party involved to make be aware via factual data and I will be the first to appologize. (Saar, I have done much further research on FUSA and you were right and this is my offical appology.) If anyone were to discontinue posting because of my comments, it would likely be because they are lacking any evidence to support their posts. Most people won't just go away when they posess documented, useful information to support their argument which is always welcome here. KEEP IN MIND THAT MANY POSTERS HERE ARE STILL REFERRING TO EXPERIAN AND TU SCORES WHEN THEY ARE POSTING THEIR APPROVALS WHICH ARE NOT BEACON SCORES AND ARE BASICALLY WORTHLESS. THESE ARE GENERATED BY IN-HOUSE CALCULATING MODELS THAT WERE DESIGNED TO MARKET THE SALE OF THEIR CREDIT REPORTS AND THATS ABOUT IT. THE ONLY TRUE BEACON SCORES ARE AVAILABLE FROM EQUIFAX, OR PERHAPS A LICENSED MORTGAGE BROKER OR OTHER LENDER I question the credibility of Ruby's statements because 1, originally stated that " authorized users are of no benefit. Many people use this method to help their scores and I am witness to several reports that did calculate AU info into the score. According to Fair Issac, the AU scores are will continue to be calculated. 2. I is widely known that a 590 score would likely have difficulty obtaining even a subprime card, especially since the problems with 10%+ charge off rates with Nextcard and Providian and the fed stepping in to regulate their lending. Why would MBNA, one of the 3 largest banks in the US want to subject themselves to this by giving platinum to someone with a 590. I am not accusing Ruby of lying, i'm sure her intentions are good but perhaps, she doesn't remember the lowest score for appoval and thought it might have been 590. I don't know. It's just that I think it was a pretty dangerous statement to make. In my experiences, MBNA criteria seems to be consistent with the other big players. SOMEONE PLEASE CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG BUT THE FORUM NEEDS ANSWERS BEFORE A BUNCH OF PEOPLE WITH 590S START APPLYING WITH MBNA AND FURTHER LOWER THEIR SCORES. THE IMPACT OF INQUIRIES ON LOW SCORING PROFILES IS DEVASTATING. FUTHERMORE MULTIPLE DECLINES IN THIS CASE WOULD DISCREDIT THE FORUM. RUBYJEAN, WE APPRECEATE YOUR TIME AND PLEASE DON'T BE OFFENDED BY MY ANALYZATIONS BUT THE FORUM NEEDS ANSWERS AT THIS POINT. 1. Does or doesn't MBNA have a minimum scoring criteria for their cards. Are their scores generated by the standard fico model or do they have their own customized model to generate the score. 2. Regarding the Platinum that was approved at 590. Was this done automatically or was it a manual override. If it was manual, what guidlines do you have to approve someone with a 590. 3. If you override, is there a minimum score for an override and if so are there several different minimum scores for override based on conditions. Please post them if so. 4. Do you personally approve cards or is your work sent to a different dept for final approval. 5. Regarding the decline at a Beacon 815. Was it declined based on personal data such as an inccorect social, date of birth etc., (yes you can pull a file with an incorrect social or no social at all but it will send up a red flag). or; were the credit history reason codes given. Please list primary reason code. Thank you BB
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Saar, Thanks for your comments, I am never the type of person who will get into on going battles with Members of this Board.. I have never professed to be a Credit Expert to anyone.. I happen to work for a Company who uses the Human Element to make a decision. Some people here, have more faith in Computers, ect.. I am posting a Memo to everyone to see.. How many other Credit Card Companys can say that they have done this> WILMINGTON, Del. (CBS.MW) - Shares of U.S. credit card issuer MBNA lost 1.5 percent Thursday after the company reported a 25 percent increase in fourth-quarter earnings, benefiting from lower interest rates the company was able to pass on to customers. Net income rose to $524.8 million, or 60 cents a share, compared with $423.8 million, or 48 cents a share for the fourth quarter of 2000. The corporation has averaged 25 percent earnings growth in each of the 44 quarters since becoming public. We will be over 100 billion in Outstanding loans by the end of the year.. This is not accomplished by using computers to make a decision.. We have just started to do instant Decisoning , in which certain Customers will receive direct mail , with a toll free Number to call and apply and they will have an instant decision on whether they are approved.. A question to those who go only by FICO scores Would you approve this person with these Demo's For a Platinum Card.. His FICO is 580 DEMO'S AGE 28 Grad from Residency in Orthopedic Surgery from Tufts University.. Employment: Chief Othopedic Surgeon Mass General Hospital Income: 450000.00 Mortgage 650000.00 Mthly payments 2880.00 Car Loan Land Rover 38k Pymt 950.00 Credit Cards On file 1 Capitol One 2500 Line Bal owed 1500 Delinquency of file 2 Majors: Paid Charge off 500.00 1998 Unpaid Charge off Sears 85.00A A couple of 30 and 60 days also What would you do ? approve or Decline You Call Doctor to find out what happened in regards to Charge Offs. Sd ran into a little financial Difficulty with Paid C/O Sears C/O due to a dispute.. Answer? A couple of 30 days.. Believe it or not reading your posts are educational to me and I would never Be critical of anyone.. The ability to have and use credit is difficult and when you are having a tough time.. It is nice to read some of the comments on this board..Most of you help one another out.. Take care , and again Saar.. Thanks
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Speaking for myself, I only reacted to being approved for a Patinum PRIME card as being "absurd" becasue I am finally used to being a "generated number" to other prime companies, that it seems strange or a PRIME company to take the TIME to look over EACH and EVERY app. Thanks for the info Ruby!
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Well Ruby, I see your point. My apologies. This is a new area to me. I guess I am getting a little judgemental because of the several people that know nothing about credit and make false statements on this board which causes problems for others but doesn't apply to you. Please stick around and thanks for your posts. Any other members are welcome to give me a swift kick in the butt if I get out of hand again. BB
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Hello Guys!!!! I hope everyone has been fine. I haven't posted in a while, but I have to agree with Rubyjean about MBNA. I can't speak for the platinum card, but I do have the Gold Option line of credit with a 20,000 limit, and my score was in the 590's when I received that limit. Although I started with a 2,500 limit, that was quite an increase for a low score. I'm a prime example of someone with no negatives and a crappy score. LadyC
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat I was wondering where you have been LadyC, I missed you. How are things? Glad to see you back here. -Peace, Dave
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Hi Dave, Things are going fine. I still can't stop applying. LadyC
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat I tend to agree with you, but I also submit that there are days that FICO scores can change dramatically with no apparent reason. Many people have posted pulling reports and seeing (real lender) scores drop by 20+ points when nothing on the report had changed. So, in these cases, while I don't believe that FICO is a "random number generator", I do think there are enough instances of inexplicable changes which do warrant human intervention in a loan decision. Therefore, a credit analyst/loan officer could easily approve a low scoring application if certain other criteia are met (hence her example of the surgeon from Boston). I agree and have posted as much a number of times on this board. I also doubt the veracity of the Scorepower Beacon score from my own experiences. Marie once posted a great post about her parent's credit union loan and a test she did to see how accurate their Scorepower scores were on the same day with the same info. I've found huge discrepancies in my own Scorepower Beacon scores and refuse to purchase them anymore for that reason. I agree again - except - Ruby Jean probably meant that AU entries alone would not impress a *human* analyst looking at a credit report. I don't think she was referring to scores, which I think we'd all agree would benefit from AU trades. If you were a loan officer, wouldn't *you* want to see some individual account pay histories and not just 10 AU account pay histories? How would you know that the applicant was paying the bills rather than mommy or daddy? That's the only point I was trying to make in Ruby Jean's defense. Manual reviews can change the approval process significantly.
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat TO: BEACON, NO NEED TO APOLOGIZE, YOU ARE OTHER REG MEMBERS HAVE HELPED ME IN REGARDS TO MY EVERYDAY JOB.. JUST TO LET YOU KNOW THAT I AM IN NO WAY A CREDIT EXPERT, I HAVE ONLY BEEN WORKING AT MBNA FOR A LITTLE OVER 3 YEARS, PREVIOUSLY I WAS A CHEF FOR OVER 25 YEARS, I STARTED OUT IN CUSTOMER SATISFACTION, ( DEPARTMENT , WHO TAKES ALL OF THE COMPLAINTS, AFTER 9 MONTHS. POSTED TO CUSTOMER ASSISTANCE AND WAS PROMOTED WITH IN 12 MONTHS FROM 30 DAY RIGHT UP TO 180 DAY , IN THE CHARGE OFF UNIT.. LAST YEAR I POSTED FOR THE CREDIT DEPARTMENT, AND GOT HIRED, WENT THROUGH A MONTHS EDUCATION , THEN PASSED THE EXAM, FOR MY LENDING AUTHORITY, AND I HAVE BEEN GOING BACK AND FORTH ON TASK FORCES TO THE CHARGE OFF UNIT, AND BACK TO CREDIT FOR THE LAST 6 MONTHS, HOPEFULLY I WILL BE ABLE TO STAY BEING A CREDIT ANALYST.. I CAN ONLY GIVE INFORMATION IN WHAT I KNOW ABOUT MY EVERY DAY JOB AT MBNA TAKE CARE RUBY
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Ruby, I'm glad we're still friends. I'm sure that theres plenty more I can learn from you as well. BB
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Quote: I also doubt the veracity of the Scorepower Beacon score from my own experiences. Marie once posted a great post about her parent's credit union loan and a test she did to see how accurate their Scorepower scores were on the same day with the same info. 1.Keep in mind that there is some personal information that is entered on a credit application such as: length of time at job, own/rent home, time at current address, etc. that are calculated in the fico score. Score power doesn't consider this information so there may be a slight variance however, I don't believe that these alone deduct enough points to cause a denial because they are not listed on Fair Isaac's 33 adverse reason codes. 2. The credit union will likely have a different model being that credit unions are generally more lenient to their customers than say, a credit card bank. Score power uses one particular model. Nevertheless , I believe it is the most commonly used model. I nor any of my clients have ever gotten a decline with a Beacon of 730+ unless it was an extaordinary case where there was very high credit line and they did a manual review to find 12 inquiries in one week, found multiple inqiures from their own bank, or a similar case.
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat 1. I asked my CU was their's an "in house" score that just used Beacon as a part of the eventual score. They said no. Their credit score is pure Beacon. They don't have an in-house scoring system that incorporates Beacon along with income, house/job history, etc... 2. I asked whether my CU's Beacon was modified for "credit cards"/"autos"/"loc" or some other special type of financing. They said no. They use the basic unmodified Beacon from Equifax. I asked all the right questions. And my Scorepower varied (on two occasions) by as much as 20+ points when being pulled (before AND after) within an hour of the CU pulling my identical report. I don't trust MyFICO.
Ruby Jean ?? Please... If I am reading things correctly here, late at night, LOL, MBNA pulls TU.... I am wondering if my hubby would have a good chance of being approved, his TU beacon score is 657, only negs on TU are paid tax liens....Some new credit...oldest credit as an au on 2 accounts...Do you think we should give it a shot? Thanks for any input
Re: Minimum Score 590 For Mbna Plat Quote: I asked all the right questions. And my Scorepower varied (on two occasions) by as much as 20+ points when being pulled (before AND after) within an hour of the CU pulling my identical report. Ask them what version of fair isaacs software they are using. If they truly know the answer to your other questions they will be able to answer that. It is unlikely that anyone at the local branch would actually know unless they are a hacker who is also very familiar with FICO scoring. The parameters are encrypted in the software and there is no way to tell what model is in that computer without calling Fair Isaac and having them look it up. Furthermore, Virtually all of Fair Isaacs models are adjustable in case of an increase in charge offs or different econnomic conditions, they can "tweak" the model to compensate.
