ok - despite being in the banking industry - i have realized how banks suck. i recently made a semi-large cash deposit via atm at the bank i work at. i do this all the time. they lost it - and debited my account for the amount claiming there was no envelope in the atm for my deposit (it semi posts prior to them pulling from the atm). they paid approx 10 items and charged fees of $27 apiece. then the a$$es turned around and returned all 10 items and charged NSF fees in the amount of $27 on those same items. BUT THEY DID NOT CREDIT ME THE RETURNED AMOUNTS. the crediors turned around and are now charged returned check fees on top of the check amounts....i figure if and when i get around clearing all this up i will be out over $1k. needless to say i closed all my accounts and moved them to a competitor. my attitude is "f*ck you!" problem is: typically i would fight like hell over this, but this is my employer. and they aren't even treating me like a customer - i think they figure that since i am employee they can just do this. i love my job and don't want to risk it. opinions please????
Don't most ATM's have cameras? You are a customer when they start charging you $27 dollars a pop...exercise all your rights!
ok - despite being in the banking industry - i have realized how banks suck. jenz ====================== Most employees of insurance Cos. and Banks don't realize that. ><- <>- ><- <> ~~~ ><- <>- ><- <> ><- <>- ><- <> ~~~ ><- <>- ><- <>
they won't even look into it! my biggest issue is i am being overcharged for each item, ie, check for $30, 1 overdraft fee $27, 1 nsf fee $27, OC $30 (without being credited the $30 back for returning it to the OC) nsf fee by OC $27 = $141 for a $30 check!!! it should either be $30 + $27 overdraft = $57 or $27 nsf + $30 to OC + $27 nsf to creditor = $84. even if i could get them to look at the tape, i'm betting they would come back with "the envelope was empty" or something like that. FWIW - most tapes aren't clear or distinguishable. with my luck there probably wasn't a tape in the machine!!!!
i guess i should rephrase that to say i thought i was somewhat immune because i know how the system works.
that sounds illegal as he$$ -can't you require them by law to reasearch it?? They can't return the items unpaid and not credit your account for what they deducted!!! And my understanding is that NSF fees are totally discretionary - they don'e HAVE to charge you those and if they want to keep you as a customer they should reverse those. You'll now get dinged $30/each by the merchants whose checks you bounced not to mention the damage to your chexsystem report. I'd fight like mad to get that straightened out - surely they're books didn't balance for that day - the cash didn't just disappear! Good luck to you Poochie
i don't work on the "banking" side of my company, but i don't think they can legally charge both nsf and overdraft fees! and i have the letters from the bank stating they paid them!!! s screw chexsystems and telecheck (see my thread on telecheck). i opened a new account immediately after this happened, so i kind of snuck through the system before anything could hit checksystems. i'm betting employee theft of the funds ($350) any ideas on how to handle this since this is my employer? typically the gloves would come off, but i want to be careful.
You could call the company that supplies the ATM machine. I'm betting that the machine takes snapshots, but doesn't run a video tape from the time you insert your card to the time that you put the envelope in the slot. Does the ATM machine stamp an identifiying number onto the envelope as it passes through into the box? Are the envelopes retained for audit purposes? You could check the procedures for clearing the ATM box with your employer. Are there two employees present at all times when the deposit envelopes are opened? I knew someone that actually PURPOSELY put in an empty envelope and THAT fraud was reported to Telecheck. You need to clear your name! Personally, I wouldn't ever want my employer thinking that I'd frauded them. Would you? I would think you could ask your supervisor (if you're on good terms) for support. He/she could be your advocate in getting to the bottom of this and finding out what procedures are in place that protect customers (you) in situations like this. They have audit records. It's never just YOUR word against THEIRS. They're a bank. They have rules they operate under. Be polite, leave the gloves on...but nail them on the procudures.
one of my friends used to work for a bank until she had a few bumps with expenses,and went negative with her own personal acct. the bank manager told her that if she cant manage her own acct successfully how could she be responsible enough to manage other peoples accts. needless to say she was layed off ( nice term 4 your fired ) anyhow, Im sure there is a record of transaction posted of how much cash was put in the ATM machine for withdrawl, and an accurate accounting of what was deposited. if they say your envelope was empty is it possible that they applied it to the wrong acct or counted it as cash left from another transaction? I would demand to see accounting ledgers, you have every right if they want to charge you fees. BTW this isnt bank one or fifty first bank is it?? you can e-mail me the answer if you want to. I ask becuase of lawsuits and other postings from the FTC inn regards to the Federal reserve who regulates banks and the Bureau of financial institutions. I feel for you, it must feel like a huge weight is hanging over you right now, there must be someone you can call anon. I wish you luck
just a thought: (im no FCBA expert) this may be an FCBA violation. if it is you have a limited amount of time to fight....60 days i think. if it could be "in any way" try to preserve your rights before the 60 days is up, it may make things easier. check out the FCBA and Butch's thread "Learn your FCBA" I went thru hell with a bank as well, after a lot of headaches it was straightened out, altho i had to pay a little to get it done. good luck bugman
thanks for the replies... i've decided to treat them no different than any other "creditor"...meaning show me proof i didn't make the deposit and prove the charges (this applies to both my bank and the OC's)...upon further examination it appears there are charges (check card) that i don't recognize (OC possible double dipping?) - i am sole person on account. one of the primary OC's i know for a fact prints the entire account number and expirationon both the receipts and the slip you sign. AND my bank has two people to pull from the machine but only one opens the envelops and enters deposit. so it could be possible that someone (namely employee of OC) got ahold of one of those slips and charged to my account. i should add that i once i saw my balance go negative i tried to close the account to prevent further charges and my bank refused.
I was a Sr VP, technology, retail operations, NYC....a word to the wise:NEVER, EVER DEPOSIT CASH IN AN ATM! I am no longer a banker but I am still well versed on banking laws and Reg CC. I do my banking with one of the largest super regionals BUT I have formed a friendly relationship with my branch manager. She has resolved so many problems for me. The worst problems I had were the $1 pre-authorization schemes (especially at gas pumps) when my account would get overdrawn but $2 and they would charge me $30 in overdraft fees. Now I knew this was not legal...and my branch manager got on the phone with my argument and got the problem solved. My legal argument was: if the bank couples an authorization code with a debit when there are inadequate funds in their accounts then on its face it becomes a "credit" transaction. Consequently the bank is obliged to cover it even though there is no "credit agreement" in place. Unfortunately the newer debit cards come with agreements in very small print (you need a magnifying glass to see it) that states you (the customer) is responsible for watching your balances. To make a long post shorter...I never use the ATM for anything but cash in hand. If I can't do it online I make a trip to my branch to make sure it is done "in house" and right. The branches do not do the ATM deposits...they are sent to another corporate department "out of house". Most bankers never use the ATMs for deposits because of the problems you have encountered. I could enumerate them all...but this post would be 10 times as long! clc
What I am thinking is that the ATM freaks out unless SOMETHING is placed in the envelope deposit slot. Whatever that something is, I hear the machine printing something on it. If they have an envelop unnaccounted for, it seems like the bank should be at fault. The bank has to admit that some sort of envelope was placed in the machine, empty or not, because the ATM just keeps beeping if you stand there, so I think they should have to find out where it went. My 2 cents about a subject I really know little about. But I am still mad!
update: so i get this polite little letter today: (not verbatem) we are concerned about the negative balance on your checking account. you made a deposit, and there was no envelope. if deposit not made to cover the negative balance your account will be closed and it will be referred to the proper authority for collection. this came in an UNSEALED envelope...i'm so livid when i read this - they are fully aware of the situation, but yet, i am the bad guy. i've been too busy the last few days to deal with this... should i send a "prove it" letter to my employer or let it go to collections first? i'm thinking i have more rights under the FDCPA, and it would take it out of the hands of my employer.
Does your bank guarantee ATM deposit? Some banks do. I'd go as high up as you have to to get answers. Make sure you send everything in writing. Send it to the CEO as well as your branch. If I were you, I'd talk to a lawyer. I had my ATM card stolen once and got no help from the bank. I put it off too long for one thing. You only have 30 or 60 days. They're counting on the fact that you'll procrastinate a little and then it will be too late. I agree with clc in that I only use my ATM card for cash from my bank's ATM. No debit card use, no depositing cash. Small withdrawals only, and make sure you take the receipt. I keep mine with my bank statements, just like canceled checks. If you don't, SHRED THEM.
I think you need to send something now about the problems with the ATM deposit to preserve your rights to recover that money. By the time it gets to collections, you might do something about the charges, but you really want to do something about your deposit as well.
Oh, what sweet irony is this? I think you should write a final letter to your employer explainly that you made the deposit in good faith and you don't know what happened, but it stinks. Impress upon them the fact that they should make you whole on this and if they choose not to, then you'll just have to deal with whatever comes down the pike. Then, you let it go to collections and come out blazing! But, keep in mind that if the collections zone is just an assignment and not a purchase, then you may still incur the wrath of your employer with all the blazing. Geez, it stinks to be on the sh*t end of things, huh? This is one sh*t thing I do not wish on anyone.
