OC/Contract PRINT/Not my sig/NO SSN

Absolutely its validation - they validated the fact that they can't prove its yours!!!!!!!!!!!!

LOL

 

hee hee

 

Sounds to me like they validated the fact that they were the victims of fraud by your ex, and are now trying to stick you with their stupidity.

 

Thanked them for sending proof that it is not mine. I sent the letter to the person who had responded and copied their CEO.
ajordan
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Now here's a different touch LOL



(THE END ** *** ** LB 59)
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Be careful! I don't mean to rain on your parade but in a court of law, I am relatively confident they would accept this as proof UNLESS you claim that you really did not authorize her to open the account. Is this the case? Did she really open the account without your authorization?

Feel free to contact the creditor directly and try to get them to remove it. However, chances are they will refuse. Then, the only recourse you have is court.

However, in a court of law, you must testify, under oath, this is not your account, you did not pay on this account, and you did not authorize the account being opened in your name. Since this may not be the case, you obviously won't have a case.

They will also subpoena your ex to appear to find out if she opened the account without your permission. If she says you authorized her to do so, then you just committed perjury.

Also, they may send you a fraud affidavit. Again, if you fill that out, you will be getting yourself in hot water.

So, basically, if you truly did not authorize the account to be opened in your name AND you never paid on the account (obviously you would NOT pay on an account you did not open), then simply contact them and state the account is fraud and you want a fraud affidavit to get it removed.

If this is not the case, you can fight with them over the accuracy of the contract but they probably won't remove it unless you fill out the fraud form.

 

Re: Re: OC/Contract PRINT/Not my sig/NO SSN

I figured I might get you a little angered but my intent was to let you know what you are dealing with. I have been disputing accounts on a relative's report for 7 months straight now and am pretty knowledgable about how things work.

Again, I am not replying to piss you off. I hope you get it removed!! I am however being the voice of reason. Sometimes we get too caught up in what a creditor or CA is failing to do. But, it really comes down to what a court of law will think if they refuse to work with you.

First, an OC is not required to validate. Only CA's are. Failing to validate is an FDCPA violation not a FCRA violation. Since an OC is not a CA, they are not required to follow the FDCPA so that violation doesn't exist.

Second, they ARE required to mark your account in dispute. This is an FCRA violation. According to 15 U.S.C. § 1681s-2(a)(3), they must update your account as being in dispute. However, according to 15 U.S.C. § 1681s-2(c), you can not hold them liable for this violation. You can only hold them liable for 15 U.S.C. § 1681s-2(b) violations so this is a violation that can't be enforced by you.

Third, it was their choice to provide you with a scanned copy of your agreement. They were not required to since they are not required to validate. They did that as a goodwill attempt to satisfy your requests. They also were not required to send you an original contract. A scanned copy would be more than sufficient in any court of law.

You state that because they don't have a contract with your SSN or your signature, they must remove. This is not the case. There is no law which states they must have an agreement with your signature and ssn# on it. Both parties must simply of had an agreement. An oral agreement is admissible in court and an oral agreement doesn't contain any SSN#'s or signatures. An agreement to open that account is an agreement REGARDLESS of whether or not your signature is on it or whether or not your SSN is on it.

I understand EXACTLY what you are doing because I did it myself for a relative. One OC was unable to produce a contract so I stated please remove it. They then replied flat out by stating, is this your account or not. We have your personal information and need to know if this account is fraudulent. If so, fill out this form if not, then it will remain. She obviously couldn't fill it out because it was her account. So, if we did take them to court, she would be asked, is this your account. She would say yes and it would be dismissed. My point is that, just because they don't have what you want doesn't mean that they MUST have what you want. We would lose if we took them to court so that wasn't an option BUT that did not stop me from threating suit and naming a bunch of violations I would sue for.

Another example is with an OC who had a contract that expired in 1999. They claimed my sister owed them a debt from 2001. I asked where is the contract they have from 2001 and they stated they didn't have one. Well, most of us would say DING DING... remove it. But, just because they don't have a physical contract, that doesn't mean an agreement did not exist. They have since refused to remove using the very obvious line of reasoning that, if she didn't have an agreement with us in 2001, why did she pay us?

Let me give you an example. You apply for a credit card over the internet. You get approved and you receive your card in the mail. Just because the OC doesn't have a signed agreement, that doesn't mean that, if you decide not to pay a $2000 bill a year later, they can't report it on your credit file.

So far, from what you have stated, you have no violations on them that you can sue them over. Further, they have the agreement that was filled out when the account was opened. This is all they need to have on file to show the account is yours (assuming no fraud). If the application used to open the account didn't have your signature and it didn't have your SSN, how are they suppose to come up with an agreement that does have your signature and does have your SSN. They can't. It is impossible. Therefore, if this was a fradulent account, you would have an excellent case. No signature on the contract and no SSN. BUT!!!! This is assuming you testify on an affidavit that it is fraud.

Therefore, in a court of law, what they have is more than sufficient to continue listing the account on YOUR report unless you specifically claim FRAUD. There is an excellent chance that they will tell you, if you believe the account is not yours, fill out a fraud affidavidt stating so. However, if you ever paid on the account, this is not possible since you obviously would not pay on an account that isn't yours.

So, my point is that, based on the documentation you have, they have every right to continue listing it on your report UNLESS you claim fraud and take the appropriate measures.

With an OC, you can't just say, you don't have my signature on this contract so delete this account from my report. With an CA you could do this but not the OC. With an OC, if you want it removed, you must come right out and state "THIS IS NOT MY ACCOUNT. MY SSN# IS NOT ON THIS CONTRACT AND NEITHER IS MY SIGNATURE." They will then reply with a fraud affidavit. Fill it out and it will be removed. Don't fill it out and it will remain.

You can't sue them for violations because they haven't done anything wrong. And, even if you did, suing them for violations would not get the items removed. You would have to sue specifically to have the item removed from your report. And, in a court of law, you would be asked point blank, if you have any knowledge of this account. If you state no, they will ask you to testify that it is fraud (I don't think you will do that). If you say yes, case dismissed.

Like I said, I am not trying to make you angry but you have to understand what is REALLY going on. I don't want you to get too caught up in what they MUST do and think you have this awesome case against them when you really don't.

HOWEVER, this does not mean you can't still make things such a headache on them that they will want to remove. I had an OC listing some stuff on a relative's report that was very much accurate and they even provided me with a contract. However, I was such a thorn in their side that, they eventually did delete after 5 months even though they had every right to continue listing. But I knew there was no way I was taking them to court.

So, you are on the right track. But, my point was just to show you that, if they don't cooperate, I would think twice about trying to sue them. But, continuing to threaten them and bother them is definately the way to go! But don't think that, based on what they have provided you, they must delete. However, that doesn't mean you can't try to make them think so (what is what it appears you are trying to do). Just don't get too overconfident and believe that you are taking them to court.

I'm trying to help YOU out with the knowledge I have gained over the last 7 months disputing stuff. If you don't want it, then ignore it.

 

Re: Re: OC/Contract PRINT/Not my sig/NO SSN

SUNHAWK: Your statements about OC validation are correct as far as Federal laws are concerned, but you fail to take into account that many states impose additional restrictions on OC's and CA's that are not covered in Federal law.

Example: http://creditcourt.com/law/Cal-Civil-Code.shtml

 

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