I have an old paid settled for less than full balance account with Associates/Citi. I sent a validation letter to them, they have until May 6, to respond. I don't believe they will, but they DID verify with CRA's, at least TransUnion. Is it any violation to do this? I know they are not required to validate. What should I do next, 48 hour validation letter, Estoppel letter?
Send the Certified Nutcase Letter. I would think that even though they are not required to validate paid accounts, they should be under SOME obligation to validate the derogatory listing they continue to report. Anyone have any thoughts as to what OC's obligations are, for paid accounts that are reporting late dates or paid charge offs? -Peace, Dave
My thought is the OC should be able to provide the consumer the same information that they provide the bureau and the supporting detail. If they verify with the CRA but not the consumer, this will ultimately come into play in Court. The OC would have to show the Judge they could prove the information supporting the trade line. Its a good sign they can't if they won't provide the consumer the information. Many companies keep "summary" systems that are for responding to disputes to the bureaus. These systems do not have the detail just if you were late or not. After a period of time, the OC will purge the supporting detail and in reality cannot "validate". They are betting most consumers won't push it. Bottom line, if you ask nicely and they won't provide you some reasonable supporting detail about your payments, then sue them. They have the burden of proof to prove that what is being reported is the truth.
If when you wrote the OC validation letter you stated that you are disputing this alleged account with them and any and all information they are reporting and they in turn verify this with the CRA this is a violation of the FCRA 623 Failure to provide notice of dispute, if they are also reporting information that you know isn't true but they won't validate or prove this information to you, you can also sue them in court under FCRA 623 Furnishers of information. They will then have to prove in court exactly what they are reporting as being true. Could be quite costly and very wasteful in time for them. I got a few OC's on the hook with that right there. I told them since they are continuing to report information I know is wrong but they won't prove it to me....Here is a copy of the lawsuit I will file on this date and the amount of damages I am seeking, Delete or be sued it is your choice! Everyone has deleted before the filing of the lawsuit. It should work for you if you word it properly. Good Luck! Tac
Tac, can you post your letter(s) that you used? I would also like to get a similar situation with an original creditor resolved. If yours worked for you then I would really like to use it as a guideline for my letter. I'd really appreciate it. Thanks, Keller
As requested here is a recent letter sent to an OC. This is my 3rd letter to them and my notice of intent to file suit. I received a call the next day when they received it stating they will DELETE this from my credit reports! I would have gone through with this suit if I'd have to. Hope this helps someone.... May 5, 2002 XXXXXX COMPANY Attn: Mr. noncompliance, Credit Manager PO BOX 12345 BLUE BELL, PA., 19422 RE: NOTICE OF PENDING LEGAL ACTION RE: Account, XXXXXX Dear Mr. Noncompliance, I am writing you this 3rd and final letter in an attempt to resolve this matter amicably. This will be my last letter sent to you before legal action is taken in this matter. I have tried respectfully and patiently to receive this information in which you are reporting to the credit bureauâ??s. To this date you have refused to supply me with this information but rather state claim to the fact that your company has no legal obligation to comply with the Fair Credit Reporting Act. You have also stated to me in our telephone conversation dated April 29th, 2002 @ 1636hrs. â??Why am I disputing this debt with you now?â? â??Why donâ??t I just dispute this with the credit reporting agency?â? â??Your company isnâ??t reporting this, it is being handled by NCO and we donâ??t report to the credit bureaus??â? â??Why donâ??t I just pay my bills?â? My reason for disputing this debt it because I am afforded that right under Federal Law, I can dispute this item or any item at any time if it is being reported on my credit files. I am allowed to question any item of information which is showing on my credit reports and ask for proof of the information which is being supplied as being correct and one hundred percent accurate. For your information I am currently disputing this information with the credit bureaus as well as with you. Your claim that your company is not supplying this information is false, Your company is listed as XXXXX and your company is reporting this debt and no other. To ensure this was the case I contacted TransUnion via telephone directly about this alleged account which is showing on my credit files. I spoke with a Customer service representative named Matt @ 1800.916.8800 on March 25th, 2002 at 11:00am. He gave the following contact info regarding this account which is showing and what address and phone number to contact as the furnisher of this information they have listed as, XXXXX Company PO Box 12345, Blue Bell, PA 19422. I especially like the claim that I should pay my bills and that I owe your company what you are alleging. I guess you would expect me to pay your company what you are asking without question or you having to prove this alleged debt to me?? I think you can realize from reading my letters that I wasnâ??t born yesterday. I am disputing this alleged debt with you because I feel the information your company is reporting is not true and accurate as I recall it to be. Why wouldnâ??t your company want to prove what you say I owe? Sloppy book keeping? Mismanagement? Unfair business practices? Your company has already violated statutes contained in the Fair Credit Reporting Act several times but you are either ignorant to the fact that you need to comply or just plain willingly violating the law. The reason for legal action against you and your company is as follows: Your company has failed to send the legally required documents to validate this debt. You have been notified that your actions are detrimental to me and that your company has violated the Pennsylvania Consumer Credit Protection Act, Fair Credit Reporting Act and defamed my character. Direct Violation of: Fair Credit Reporting Act 15 U.S.C. $1681s-2 $623 DUTY OF FURNISHERS OF INFORMATION TO PROVIDE ACCURATE INFORMATION. Fair Credit Reporting Act 15 U.S.C. $1681s-2 $623 (3) DUTY TO PROVIDE NOTICE OF DISPUTE Fair Credit Reporting Act 15 U.S.C. $1681s-2 $616 CIVIL LIABILITY FOR WILLFUL NONCOMPLIANCE. Fair Credit Reporting Act 15 U.S.C. $1681s-2 $617 CIVIL LIABILITY FOR NEGLIGENT NONCOMPLIANCE DEFAMATION OF CHARACTER Your company knew or should have known that the actions taken against me was inappropriate and damaging to me. You and your company failed to use reasonable care in the course of business and failed to use even minimal procedures to insure that I was not harmed. As a result of these blatantly reckless, wanton, and intentional acts, I have suffered and continue to suffer general and specific damages. I am also very upset at your companyâ??s intentional infliction of emotional distress, other diminishments of the quality of my life and refusal to follow the law. In my last letter dated April 26th, 2002 I stated a fair resolution to this matter without the need for further aggravation, time and legal expenses by simply contacting the credit bureauâ??s youâ??ve reported this account to and having it deleted from my credit files. You have failed to agree to this easy resolution and your non-compliance of proving the information you are reporting to the credit bureaus as being true, correct and accurate amazes me. Maybe you donâ??t feel the need to take me seriously or feel I am the one who is misinformed about the law. That of course may be your assumption but it will also be your downfall. As you might guess I am keeping very thorough records of all contact with you and your company. I have received to date only phone calls from you and verbal assurances that you would provide me with this information, to date you have provided not one shred of evidence to prove what you are reporting about me is true and accurate. In final summation I am again requesting a final resolution to this matter as stated. If you wish to resolve this matter, this will be your last opportunity to do so. This alleged account MUST be DELETED from my credit files with the three major credit reporting bureauâ??s (Equifax, TransUnion, Experian) within 15 days from tracked and verifiable receipt of this letter. Forward a letter to me via regular U.S. mail stating it has been removed and will not reappear on my credit reportâ??s again. I will accept nothing less. Also be aware that if this account is not deleted within 15 days of receipt, I will file a formal complaint with the Federal Trade Commission, Pennsylvania Attorney Generalâ??s office, Better Business Bureau and the stateâ??s reality licensing commission or bureau. Also note that section 1681s-2(b)of the Fair Credit Reporting Act creates a cause of action for a consumer against a furnisher of erroneous credit information (Nelson v. Chase Manhattan). This notice is an attempt to inform you that legal action is pending and the information you are reporting is inaccurate and in full dispute in an attempt to correct your records, and any information received from you will be collected as evidence should this case result in legal action against you or your company. If you do not delete this information from my credit reports as listed above within 15 days, my lawsuit will be filed as enclosed on Friday, May 17th, 2002 in Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, County of Northampton at the Honorable Michael J. Koury, JRâ??s office Magistrate District Number 03-2-12, 1710 Butler St., Easton, PA., 18042-4621. If you wish to notify me that you are agreeing to delete all information from my credit reports and the closing of this matter, you must call prior to the close of business on Friday, May 17th, 2002. I can be reached at (555)123-4567. Thank you and I look forward to your resolving this matter most expeditiously. Respectfully, Unhappy consumer CC: (1)Atorney (2)File This letter seems to have been the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak. I was in contact via phone with this idiot and even told him I would be filing suit. His reply "Go ahead sue us!" Well he wasn't saying that when I spoke to him after receiving this letter. Also note I did include an actual copy of a filled out civil complaint received from my jursidiction which was going to be filed on that date. Good Luck! Tac
TAC. . . "AWESOME" IS THE ONLY ADJECTIVE THAT I CAN COME UP WITH AT THIS MOMENT! GREAT LETTER! I THINK THAT THIS TYPE OF LETTER IS THE "PERFECT" LETTER TO SEND FROM THE CONSUMER. CERTAINLY WITHOUT PREJUDICE TO THE OTHER GREAT LETTERS THAT PBM HAS POSTED ON THIS BOARD FROM OTHERS, THIS LETTER SOUNDS LIKE IT IS COMING FROM AN EDUCATED CONSUMER WITH JUST THE RIGHT KNOWLEDGE ABSENT A LOT OF LEGAL TALK. I THINK THAT THIS WOULD BE ANOTHER GREAT LETTER TO POST ON THE BOARD! PERHAPS ONE OF OUR "CREDITNEXPERTS" WOULD TAKE THIS LETTER AND PERFECT IT FOR EVERYONE TO USE! MAYBE JUST A SLIGHT "TWEEK". . .IT CERTAINLY WOULDN'T TAKE MUCH. I THINK IT'S GREAT AND I'M ABOUT TO BEGIN MY OWN RENDITION OF YOUR LETTER. YOU'RE GONNA BE FAMOUS! :O) THANKS FOR TAKING THE TIME TO POST IT, TAC! THIS WILL HELP A LOT OF PEOPLE IF THEY KNOW ABOUT IT! KELLER
Tac, great letter. I'm really confused though, I have had many suggestions the past couple days. Someone suggested a 3 day deletion letter, another the nutcase letter, another the estoppel. I have another CA that has reported 9 collections on my report for medical accounts, I believe my insurance paid them, the CA won't validate, I just sent out my disputes on these accounts with the CRA's, so I can see if they verify. then another creditor sent partial validation, a statement, no signature, and they verified. then the above mentioned account, I have three OC that I settled with in 99, they won't validate, but verify. Any advice on which letters should follow would be great. Thanks.
