Help please? I have a collection agency calling me trying to collect on an old unpaid debt that is way past the SOL for both where the debt was incurred, and where I currently live. Because it's been more than 10 years, the judgement has fallen off of my credit reports. The debt is more than 15 years old. However, the collection agency has recently pulled one of my reports for review and is now calling me asking for payment of the debt (or rather for 10 times what the debt originally was) Upon research I found that Michigan (where the debt was incurred) states a "renewable" SOL for another 10 years. I thought that once the SOL has expired that it was a done deal(!?) Does this mean it will show up again on my reports? I thought also they had to stop collection activity? Can someone offer some advice/assistance? Thanks! As far as paying what I owe, I tried working with them about 7 years ago, and they were unwilling to work with my current income, and came into by bank accounts and wiped me clean without warning me, using the judgement as reason - which ultimately caused me to miss alot of other payments and adversely affected my credit. I've since vowed to not ever give them another dime.
1*I thought that once the SOL has expired that it was a done deal(!?) 2*Does this mean it will show up again on my reports? 3*I thought also they had to stop collection activity? cma ************************* 1*There is no SOL on a judgment. 2*It very well could. 3*They can try to collect on a debt that is beyond SOL and in your case they can also take action to collect because it's not a debt but rather it's a judgment. ><- <>- ><- <> ~~~ ><- <>- ><- <> ><- <>- ><- <> ~~~ ><- <>- ><- <> http://newfunpages.com/taxform.php3 ><- <>- ><- <> ~~~ ><- <>- ><- <> ><- <>- ><- <> ~~~ ><- <>- ><- <>
If they got a judgment against you, it is still valid even though the entry on your CR dropped off after 7 years. You are confusing the SOL to COLLECT ON A JUDGMENT with the SOL for reporting to the CRA's. It is quite possible that the judgment can be renewed every 10 years, depending on state law! By renewing the judgment they will continue to do this until it is paid. The 7 years passing only removed the notation from your CR. It does not relieve you of the responsibility to satify the judgment
Re: Re: "Renewable" SOL??? Help! OK pd, lbrown, and bugman. Thanks for your responses, I appreciate them! I probably wasn't clear when I posted this, but what I question is what is a renewel, and when can it take place. What I found at http://www.carreonandassociates.com/sol.htm says: ...The original statute of limitations begins at the onset of the contract signing. Statute of limitations vary from state to state but it is usually 4-6 years depending on the state. The term statute of limitations means the time allotted to legally enforce the debt. If a statute expires and someone sues you, It is up to you to bring the expired SOL defense to the other parties attention. If you say nothing or do not bring up the expired statute then the judgment can be entered. Don't assume it means the other party is barred from attempting to collect. It simply means that your defense is the expired SOL not to enforce the lawsuit. If your statute of limitations has expired that means that the debt cannot be enforced by lawsuit, that does not dismiss the debt and the creditor can still leave it on your credit for 7 years (excluding some public records, those can remain for 10 years) but legally you do not have to pay it if the statute has expired. Based on your response pd11604, even though the judgement was removed from my reports, the CA can continue collection activity... So my questions are: 1) If the judgement was filed more than 10 years ago, and remains unpaid, can they still collect on it? 2) If yes to #1, can they re-enter it on my credit report ever? 3) What does "renewing" the judgement mean, and what good what it do from thier perspective? What would cause it to renew? 4) Is there an SOL for collecting on a judgement that has been removed from my reports and I haven't had contact with the creditor or any agency for more than 7 years? What are my rights? Can they just continue to contact me but don't really have any ground to stand on? Thanks for your help!!!!
Re: Re: Re: "Renewable" SOL??? Help! Yes, depending on your state's law concerning collections on judgments, but, If your state says that you have 10 years to collect on a judgment, and 10 years has passed, there is nothing more that can be done I'm not sure if a CA could do this, I would think that they can if they are trying to collect a legitimate debt. The actual public record of the judgment would come off your CR after 7 years though. In a lot of states a judgment runs for so many years, then the creditor is allowed to "renew" it by going to court to keep it in force for another "x" amount of years. These renewal periods are usually long - up to 20 years, and sometimes up to forever if state law allows The SOL for collecting judgments is governed by state law, basically the answer to this is the same as the answer to #3. The CA can come after you for as long as the judgment is valid
Re: Re: Re: Re: "Renewable" SOL??? Help! Thanks again pd! Please indulge me once more... Originally posted by pd11604 Yes, depending on your state's law concerning collections on judgments, but, If your state says that you have 10 years to collect on a judgment, and 10 years has passed, there is nothing more that can be done So if they choose to use Michigan's SOL, (6 yrs) but I paid some on the debt 7 yrs ago, the SOL is still expired, and they cannot collect at all? In a lot of states a judgment runs for so many years, then the creditor is allowed to "renew" it by going to court to keep it in force for another "x" amount of years. These renewal periods are usually long - up to 20 years, and sometimes up to forever if state law allows But don't they have to renew it before it expires the first time? (judgement lapses) Does this also mean they cannot sue for a new judgement if there is still a debt? The CA can come after you for as long as the judgment is valid How do I check to see if it's still valid? Thanks pd!!!
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: "Renewable" SOL??? Help! I think you are confusing the SOL to collect on a debt, and the SOL to collect on a judgment. . . If they got a judgment on this debt then, in Michigan, they can collect on the judgment for 10 years, and renew it to collect for 10 more years "Judgments: 10 years, but are renewable by action for another 10 years, MCL.600.5809(3)" I think the answer to both your questions is YES, but I'm not a lawyer! The court house where the judgment was entered will have all the paperwork concerning the case
That's what I was thinking. Go to the courthouse and find out if there is a judgment against you. If it was "renewed" they'd certainly be able to tell you the original date as well as the "renewed" date and perhaps point you to a web page, or a law library with details about renewal terms. I have only heard someone mention this once, and it was for a state tax lien in the state of CA, but other than that this "renewal" is a new one on me. Good luck.
If the judgment is "renewable by action" that means that the creditor needs to bring another case in court. That should also mean that the OP would need to be served with court papers, or the creditor would need to use substitute service if the OP could not be found ... obviously, they did find the OP, so the question now is how many years ago the original judgment was rendered and whether it has expired before the creditor filed an action to renew it? And if they did file an action to renew it, has that action already resulted in a default renewal, or is there time to respond with a defense? And which defenses are available? And if there was a default, under what circumstances can it be reopened? There are a lot of questions. Many can be answered by going to the clerk's office and going through the file.
I know it varies from state to state. In some states, they can simply file papers asking for a renewal. Judgments are different than the SOL for collecting on a debt, as others have said. That's because they have already sued you and gotten a judgment. They could garnish your wages if that is allowed in your state. It might be a good idea to try to settle this. Get any agreements in writing.
Thanks all! Since I live out of state and can't get easy access to the court records, that will have to wait until I can make the trip. (unless someone knows of a free way to access Michigan state judgement records) Otherwise, from what I've learned, I think the SOL is up for both collection on the account, and, obviously recording it on my credit report. The unknown is whether or not the collection agency can renew the judgement or not. Thanks again for all your help.
Thanks all! Since I live out of state and can't get easy access to the court records, that will have to wait until I can make the trip. (unless someone knows of a free way to access Michigan state judgement records) Otherwise, from what I've learned, I think the SOL is up for both collection on the account, and, obviously recording it on my credit report. The unknown is whether or not the collection agency can renew the judgement or not. Thanks again for all your help.
***Based on your response pd11604, even though the judgement was removed from my reports, the CA can continue collection activity... 1) If the judgement was filed more than 10 years ago, and remains unpaid, can they still collect on it? 2) If yes to #1, can they re-enter it on my credit report ever? 3 a*What does "renewing" the judgement mean, b*what good what it do from thier perspective? c*What would cause it to renew? 4) Is there an SOL for collecting on a judgement that has been removed from my reports and 5*I haven't had contact with the creditor or any agency for more than 7 years? Mike====== ********************************** *** Correct. There is no law that says you have to report it to a CRA or you can't collect on the judgment. 1*If it was renewed yes! 2*YES. 3 a*it extends the length of time they have to collect on it. b*gives them longer to collect on the judgment. c*they never got paid the first time around. 4*NO 5*Forget the 7 year reporting period it has nothing to do with how long they can collect on a judgment or any other debt.
***Based on your response pd11604, even though the judgement was removed from my reports, the CA can continue collection activity... 1) If the judgement was filed more than 10 years ago, and remains unpaid, can they still collect on it? 2) If yes to #1, can they re-enter it on my credit report ever? 3 a*What does "renewing" the judgement mean, b*what good what it do from thier perspective? c*What would cause it to renew? 4) Is there an SOL for collecting on a judgement that has been removed from my reports and 5*I haven't had contact with the creditor or any agency for more than 7 years? Mike====== ********************************** *** Correct. There is no law that says you have to report it to a CRA or you can't collect on the judgment. 1*If it was renewed yes! 2*YES. 3 a*it extends the length of time they have to collect on it. b*gives them longer to collect on the judgment. c*they never got paid the first time around. 4*NO 5*Forget the 7 year reporting period it has nothing to do with how long they can collect on a judgment or any other debt.
***Based on your response pd11604, even though the judgement was removed from my reports, the CA can continue collection activity... 1) If the judgement was filed more than 10 years ago, and remains unpaid, can they still collect on it? 2) If yes to #1, can they re-enter it on my credit report ever? 3 a*What does "renewing" the judgement mean, b*what good what it do from thier perspective? c*What would cause it to renew? 4) Is there an SOL for collecting on a judgement that has been removed from my reports and 5*I haven't had contact with the creditor or any agency for more than 7 years? Mike====== ********************************** *** Correct. There is no law that says you have to report it to a CRA or you can't collect on the judgment. 1*If it was renewed yes! 2*YES. 3 a*it extends the length of time they have to collect on it. b*gives them longer to collect on the judgment. c*they never got paid the first time around. 4*NO 5*Forget the 7 year reporting period it has nothing to do with how long they can collect on a judgment or any other debt.
So, lBrown, the trick here is that it needs to be renewed before they can re-report it OR continue to collect on it. If they don't renew it, they can do neither?
1*So if they choose to use Michigan's SOL, (6 yrs) but I paid some on the debt 7 yrs ago, the SOL is still expired, and they cannot collect at all? 2*But don't they have to renew it before it expires the first time? (judgement lapses) 3*Does this also mean they cannot sue for a new judgement if there is still a debt? 4*The CA can come after you for as long as the judgment is valid 5*How do I check to see if it's still valid? cma;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;; 1*You need to get one thing straight in your mind debts and judgments are 2 different things , The SOL applies only to debts it does not cover judgments. 2*Yes they do. 3*Yes 4*Correct,but it can be valid for as long as they can keep renewing it. 5*Check with the issuing court.
I have a question that I didn't see addressed yet. If the judgement was originally entered in Michigan but the OP has since moved to a different state, wouldn't they have to have the judgement domesticated (I think that is what it is called) in order to collect? paw67
