Reverse engineering FICO

Discussion in 'Credit Talk' started by KJ1, Oct 2, 2001.

  1. KJ1

    KJ1 Member

    Hi all,

    Figuring out fico shouldn't be too hard. I'm willing to spend some times on weekends to try to figure out their scoring modal. All you really need is 30-40 scores and reports to experiment on, and find some use for all those wasted hours of calculus back in school :)

    If we had a free scoring option, it would take a lot of the guesswork and mystique out of FICO, and give us some real idea on how to improve it (other than trial and error, and coughing up $13 for each score power).

    Any input?
  2. Cadillac408

    Cadillac408 Well-Known Member

    I'm willing to help in any way that would be benificial to the board.
  3. MikeB

    MikeB Banned

    Well, I made A's in Calculus I, II, and III, and I have come to the conclusion that FICO scores are those imaginary numbers you learn about in Algebra.
    Or it is a random number generator.....

    GEORGE Well-Known Member

    A random number generator...I PAY $10,000+ (ONE MONTH) AND MY SCORE GOES DOWN (EVERYTHING ELSE STAYING THE SAME)...
  5. matty61184

    matty61184 Well-Known Member

    I am in pre-calculus this year. I hate math with a passion, but I do good in the class. I just haven't found a practical use for it yet. I use simple math, not the complex things we are learning now. Probably more practical in engineering and the such. I use a lot more science and the simple power of having common sense.
  6. breeze

    breeze Well-Known Member

    I'll contribute information. If they engineer it, someone else can reverse engineer it. However, my true vote is with the random number generator.
  7. KJ1

    KJ1 Member

    That is precisely the reason why we need to have the formula for FICO. There's obviously things they aren't telling us, so we need to figure it out for ourselves.

    At the very least, we can get a better scoring modal than who give everybody a 5. LOL

  8. breeze

    breeze Well-Known Member

    No no no!! I have a 32 on worthnothing. It was 32 before TU rdeleted the judgment I had vacated, so, all excited, I go to check a week or so later, and it's still 32. What kind of math do you use to figure that one?

    GEORGE Well-Known Member

    I got 100 for my first score...dropping eventually to 59 +/-
    I owe >$30,000 less with 59 than when I got the 100!!!
  10. supershawn

    supershawn Well-Known Member

    Although it's a good idea, I think it would be nearly impossible. Think about it, creditexpert and the like are doing the same thing and only come close. And they have a team of programmers and insider info!

    Good luck- I'll contribute but I thin we'd be over our heads on that one. The combinations are in the millions....

  11. making

    making Well-Known Member

    Simply not true. Maybe you can get a good approximation, but exactly never. If you think so, you should start counting the number of possible combinations.
  12. bbauer

    bbauer Banned

    For all you math gurus, I have a couple of problems although they don't relate to credit.

    1. A horse race is 6 furlongs. The winner ran the 6 furlongs in 70.2 seconds. The 2nd place horse was 1/2 length behind the winner. What was the physical length of the 2nd horse?

    2. An army marches 1 mile. At the exact moment that the army starts to march, a runner positioned at the rear of the army started running to the front, handed a message to the general at the front of the army and ran to the back of the army once again. During the time the runner was running, the army marched 1 mile. How far did the runner run?
  13. KJ1

    KJ1 Member

    I agree, we'll never get the EXACT scoring modal, almost impossible to do (especialy with that random number generator somewhere in the middle :)

    But we can get a good proximity to the real score, and it would be free. You could also experiment to see what could increase your score to a desired fico, kind of like creditexperts simulator, but with all the factors to play with, not just 5-6.

  14. supershawn

    supershawn Well-Known Member

    Well, if you guys just want an approximation, just get a trial and use the simulator to simulate all options and plot the score. It would be easy enought to write a javascript app to simulate the creditexpert score.

    The thing is, creditexpert IS a CRA for the most part. They are privy to insider FICO info and look how off their simulator is.

  15. KJ1

    KJ1 Member

    I set up an E-mail account to send your reports.

    Needless to say (but I'm gonna say it anyway) :
    Don't put any personal information on the reports you send in (ie SSN, account #, names, addresses, DOB etc.).

    As only equifax scorepower gives the REAL fico, please send in only reports from equifax and scores generated with scorepower. Getting scores from other services would really hurt the results.

    The most useful information would be two (or more)reports from a single person. That way it is much easier to isolate single factors affecting your score.

    This is not for profit, and will only serve as a free tool to people on this board and others.

    Thanks in advance everybody,
  16. Erica

    Erica Well-Known Member

    I don't know about you guys, but I definately don't feel comfortable sending my reports to anyone who has only posted 4 times. I mean, there is account information and other personal stuff on there besides SSN, DOB, address and name. Feel free to send this person your report, but I'm happy in the dark when it comes to FICO.
  17. chelechele

    chelechele Well-Known Member

    hmmm Erica.......hmmmmm.....
  18. supershawn

    supershawn Well-Known Member

    Based on the credit expert simulator, I calculated approximately 481,890,304 combinations on a file. And that leaves out options that are not included in the simulator. How are you going to get that from '30 or so' reports?

    Again, I applaud your enthusiasm, but I can't see how the simulator could be reverse engineered with such little information to be anywhere near as accurate as theirs (which doesn't seem to be that accurate) especially when they are privy to the Fico model itself.

  19. Erica

    Erica Well-Known Member

    :) Chele
  20. chelechele

    chelechele Well-Known Member

    I knew you would know what I meant...LOL ;)

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