Trick or ????

Discussion in 'Credit Talk' started by raiderpam, Oct 31, 2001.

  1. raiderpam

    raiderpam Well-Known Member

    Hi I had a repo in 97 from flagstaff they turned it over to wells fargo who turned it over to Central Credit, I sent validation letters to all three , this is the response I received from wells fargo, Flagship is now owned by wells fargo, yesterday a copy of the original contract was mailed to central credit when it arrives at there office they will send it to you once I receive it the debt will be validated, when I mailed the the copy of the contract to central credit I informed them that they were no longer needed to provide collection services regarding your debt, bla bla bla and I REFERED this matter to our lawsuit referral department were they are making arrangement to proceed against you in a california court, we may be interested in stopping leagal action against you if you contact this office immediately ,this is a valid debt bla bla bla . I really dont think they have anything what do you experts think? They do try to scare the hell out of you.But why didnt he just send it to me if they really have it??
  2. PsychDoc

    PsychDoc Well-Known Member

    They cannot proceed legally against you while they are acting on your legal right to have the debt validated. Sounds like a trick (and not a treat) to me. However, you should not have sent validation letters to all three; rather, you should have only sent a validation letter to the latest owner of the debt (which is, I assume, the one that wants to collect at this point). It is likely that the latest owner of the debt would be unable to validate; at that point you turn to the "estoppel" letter and demand the alleged obligation be removed from your credit files and further collection action cease. If you go back to the original creditor, you've increased your chances that the debt WILL be validated; for that reason, I'm not sure why you did that. Clearly the debt has been sold twice; you should only deal with its present owner.

  3. raiderpam

    raiderpam Well-Known Member

    Hi I sent it to the original because it kept coming back as verified when I would dispute it, I sent it to wells fargo because they were the next ones claiming I owed them and two days after I sent the one to wells fargo I received it from the other agency, Now wells fargo says that they bought out the whole company not just the debt, and I owe them but they said to wait for the validation to come from the agency they sent it to, why wouldn"t they just send it to me with this letter if they have it,?I hope I didnt mess things up sending it out to all three, I thought I was doing it the right way in order to get it taken off my report. So are you saying never send a validation letter to the orgianal creditor,do you think there bluffing? or did I open a can of bad worms,I new flagship was no longer in busness they were the orginal owner but if I can remember right they were bought out by someone before wells fargo Thanks for your help
  4. PsychDoc

    PsychDoc Well-Known Member

    Oh, Pam, I have to admit that I'm in way over my head, lol! Thanks for the additional details, but I'm now going to defer to some of the more experienced and wiser Creditnet members for the answer to this one.

    It's my feeling that you should only ask for a formal validation from whoever owns the debt currently; you're hoping that they won't be able to produce that signed contract, and then you'll have grounds to ask that collection efforts cease and that the credit file notations be removed.

    I hope at least that little bit of information helps. Somebody bail me out here, I'm drowning, glub, glub, lol. :)

  5. raiderpam

    raiderpam Well-Known Member

    Thanks didnt mean to drown you, Wells Fargo were the last one that had sent me a collection notice, I received the notice from cental collections two days after I mailed wells fargo the validation letter, so I dont know if they were already in the process of turning it over to the other cb but now they say the other cb will validate it and they will collect.
  6. bbauer

    bbauer Banned

    Well, let's see now then.
    OH YEAH! And mares eat oats and does eat oats and little lambs eat ivy too, don't they?
    They might think they got it validated, but it's gonna be time them little lambs learned that all they got to eat is poison ivy!!!

    That's Validation???? Yeah, sure! Gimme a break!

    YEA GANG! GO GANG GO! SIS BOOM BAH! Make that double Bah with a Humbug flying along behind it.
    They might be interested in stopping legal action but I sure would not be ineterested in any such thing. Anyway not in the way they have in mind.

    Well, they most likely do have something against you. There is a supposedly valid contract in their possession according to them. They seem to have sense enough to know better than to send it to you directly and instead send it through the collector. That's what they are supposed to do. But you demanded validation out of all three of them. That means that collector #3 has to send you a copy of the validation and collector #2 has to send you a copy of the validation and if the top dog in the pile is not the original creditor with whom you originally signed the contract then #3 has to send you a copy of the validation as well. Any one breaking the law by breaking the chain is guilty under the law and the original creditor is culpable under agency law for violations of the law performed on behalf of the original creditor under some conditions.

    And that's just for the original violation of failure to validate in the first place. The validation they plan to send you isn't even a validation in the first place, so that's another full set of violations by each. (maybe) And then on top of that, can they prove they ever sent it in the first place? If not, that's still another set of violations. Once you wake them up to the whole mess, they ought to be real happy with you. They want to sue you? Hey! That's probably cool too. If they can't get a simple validation right, then they most likely can't get a lawsuit right either. Taking that silly contract under their arms and running off to the courthouse would sure prove they are a bunch of dim bulbs. And you know what? I'll bet the judge would be stupid enough to give them a judgment too. Shouldn't take too long after that you could be crying all the way to the bank to deposit their money. Oh granted, it wouldn't likely be n time for Xmas this year, but what the heck. you would be fairly likely to make it by the next xmas after that.

    Like I said, it appears that the guy may know some of what he is supposed to do under the law. So you can't afford to underestimate your enemy, so give him the benefit of the doubt. Not going to make any difference in the final outcome anyway. They might be half way educated but it's not likely they are more than half way educated. It's your civic duty to give them a good education, doncha know?
  7. raiderpam

    raiderpam Well-Known Member

    Thanks bbauer I knew you would come thru for me do I need to get a lawyer or is something I can do myself and if they send me the orginial copy that I dont receive what do I do from there, I have been trying to get things cleaned up in order to buy a house next summer and a jugement sure wont help.Can you handle this, what is the fee?
  8. bbauer

    bbauer Banned

    You don't have any judgments now do you? If you do, I probably can help you out. There is no fee for giving you a few suggestions, things to look for so you know if you need to go consult a lawyer or what. But I can't give you any legal advice because I'm not a lawyer. I wouldn't make a pimple on a lawyer's nose.
    I won't discuss any such thing on the forum. If you are interested in continueing this discussion you will have to take it up in email.
  9. tom65432

    tom65432 Well-Known Member

    Let me give you some background that may help. I had a loan with Wells Fargo I cosigned for. It defaulted. They never contacted me, claiming it is their poicy to never contact the cosigner. They sent it to collections. I called Wells Fargo and they referred me to the collection agency. It is important to remember that up to this point, I had perfect credit and had never dealt with a collection agency. I had also never heard of this board.

    The collection agent for NCO explained that they were part of Wells Fargo (I still don't know if that was true). He knew more about my finances than I did. Knew exactly how much was in my bank acccount and how much remained available on each credit card. When I first spoke with him, it was about one week after Wells Fargo turned it over to the collection agency.

    He informed me it was in legal and that I had to pay that day or they would sue. He said they would settle for the debt plus just over $2,000 in "legal fees". He scared the hell out of me and I paid. Shortly thereafter, I found creditnet and someone here posted a dialogue with a collection agent. It was almost word for word what I heard. It was then I realized I had been screwed.

    To date (almost one year later) Wells Fargo has not sent me any statement itemizing the "attorney fees" and other costs associated with this as they had promised. They will not speak to me.

    They promised to delete in return for payment. I paid, they "forgot" to delete. After a battle, they did delete. I have yet to hear of anyone else getting stuck with collection fees in that amount.

    I am not seeking advice. The point I am making is to be careful with them. Learn from my mistakes. Don't trust them. If they promise to delete, get it in writing. And, you should be able to settle for no more than what you owe.

    I won the stupid award and I may have set a record for stupidity in dealing with a collection agent that no one can ever break.
  10. bbauer

    bbauer Banned

    And you even posted proof of your award!

    Running and ducking while LMAO

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