universal default

Discussion in 'Credit Talk' started by fun4u2, Dec 17, 2004.

  1. fun4u2

    fun4u2 Well-Known Member

    can someone plz explain this term in more detail.

    I was under the impressin that this applied to late or missed payments.

    I was recently informed it applies to going over the CL ?

    so say if one of your CC goes over the limit ( & you cure it right away)

    this gives other creditors the right to raise your interest rate automatically because you went over the limit ?
     
  2. fun4u2

    fun4u2 Well-Known Member

    any help plz ???

    has anyone heard of this before ?

    is it legal ?

    is there case law?

    I was unable to find it in the written disclosure.
     
  3. ontrack

    ontrack Well-Known Member

    This might be harder for CC companies to do, since the credit reports often don't accurately show credit limits. Some CC companies don't even report credit limits, to prevent others from making offers to their customers. Your other companies don't have access to your statements, only what is reported. Is there a CR field even indicating over the limit? FICO appears to use high balance if there is no credit limit given, but a current balance matching a high balance does not indicate over your credit limit.

    In the end, what companies can get away with depends on what customers will put up with. If you have better offers from other banks, and one bank pulls something, they're history. Make yourself an attractive customer, and you will get the best terms.
     
  4. fun4u2

    fun4u2 Well-Known Member

    Ontrack

    I have noticed that some CC companies have been doing acct reviews soft pulls.

    all the accts show the CL and the current bal + pay history so they CAN actually tell if the bal was over CL.

    the prob is even if it was in error & the CC company reversed the fees & balance they didnt update the CR to show the error.


    therefore when another cc company pulls for IQ they see it all & raise the interest.

    any protection for the consumer in this case?
     
  5. ontrack

    ontrack Well-Known Member

    Litigation over small amounts usually doesn't pay. It's necessary mainly when the repercussions go beyond the amounts involved, such as erroneous credit reporting impact on other relationships, multiplying the damage.

    The problem in this case is that party A may take an action that leads party B to damage you. Even if party A fixes their error, party B doesn't reverse the damage. The solution is to always have party C in the wings, so you can dump them both. Let them consider the $100 cost of obtaining new good customers next time they implement foolish policies. Also don't run your balances so close to your limits.

    Market diversification is your only reliable protection. Predatory behavior deserves lost business. If they don't want you, you don't want them. Make sure someone else does want your business.
     
  6. ontrack

    ontrack Well-Known Member

    Think like a buyer or purchasing agent:

    Some fraction of your vendors are giving you less than the best terms, or poor service, or otherwise annoying you. Every year shop around and replace 10-20% with potentially better vendors. If they work out, good. If not, they are the ones dumped.

    You steadily increase your proportion of vendors that give good terms. You have no need to take poor offers. In fact you take your best vendor's best offers. You don't have to do anything all at once. If a problem arises, you already have several vendors clammering to solve it. No one vendor has you by the balls.

    It's like rebalancing your retirement portfolio.
     
  7. Hedwig

    Hedwig Well-Known Member

    I'm bothered by this concept. I have a card that has been upgraded to a Signature Visa. They have no pre-approved limit, kind of. They give you a "credit access line" which is like a credit limit. However, you can go over that limit if they approve it. You will have to pay the amount over your credit access line as well as the minimum on your credit access line the next month, but you have no over limit fee.

    The idea is that if you're traveling or something, you can go over your "limit" and pay it the next month.

    However, I noticed something very strange on my reports. When the card was upgraded, my credit limit was $9400. My credit limit (credit access line) is now $18,200. But my credit reports show my LIMIT as $9400. I had a balance of about $15,000 at one time, because I did a balance transfer.

    So are you saying that another issuer could pull my credit report, assume that I'm in the neighborhood of $6K over my limit and jack my rates?

    I would definitely file against them, and send a copy to everyone I could think of.

    I can see if you're late that they can assume you have problems, but everyone knows some cards don't report limits at all or don't report them properly.
     
  8. Hedwig

    Hedwig Well-Known Member

    According to this article, universal default is a company raising rates because you're late on another card. While I don't approve of it, I can at least see a basis for it. But the credit limit idea just doesn't make sense.
     
  9. ontrack

    ontrack Well-Known Member

    Your card's flexible limit sounds similar to the classic Amex card. No predetermined limit, but you pay it off every month.

    Any CC company is free to raise or lower your rates at any time any way. The problem would be if they advertised their rate as "fixed", or offered a "fixed on balance transfer until paid", and they renegged on this without terms in their contract or offer specifically allowing it, it would be both a breach of contract, as well as false advertising.

    An actual "late" reported by another card would probably meet the conditions of their contract terms for raising rates, since the reporting company is in effect reporting an account that is "delinquent" and not meeting their own contract terms, but inferring someone else's limit, or using a different company's reporting to infer that the customer is not meeting another's contract when they are not reporting it as such would probably make a great opportunity for class action attorneys.

    "Late payments" are specifically reported as such. Is "over credit limit" specifically reported, or must it be inferred from often erroneously reported credit limits and balances?
     
  10. Hedwig

    Hedwig Well-Known Member

    It must be inferred. That's the problem.

    My card differs from AMEX in that the balance within the "credit access line" can be revolved. Only any portion over that limit must be paid in full. So it's sort of the best of both worlds. You can revolve the part within limit, but if you have to go over, you can, without fear of overlimit fees. You just have to pay that part. But if you're on vacation and have an emergency, for example, you can charge it until you get home to get at your other money.
     
  11. fun4u2

    fun4u2 Well-Known Member

    what next ?

    I work hard to pay all my debts ontime and I have good credit now to show for it until recently some yahoo CA threw some 4 year old low $ acct on my report .

    problem is I don't owe it and I sent them a letter with proof showing that it was sent to them in error as it was paid in full years ago.

    the dilemma is a few of my creditors recently did account reviews and saw the TL.

    now I am receiving letters stating Im in universal default which caused a significant increase to my interest rates.

    since this is obviously an error what are the odds the creditors would reverse the rate on the basis of providing a letter of error from the CA?
     
  12. ontrack

    ontrack Well-Known Member

    Did you pay this CA, or did you pay an earlier OC who sent it, or sold it to this CA in error? I.e.: Who was negligent?
     
  13. fun4u2

    fun4u2 Well-Known Member

    HI Ontrack, :)
    I paid the OC over 5 years ago when my service was closed. the acct was appearantly sent to collections in error.

    I wanted to resolve this matter quickly, so I contacted both the OC and the CA at the same time .

    as a coutesy I provided copies of all my old statements and receipts to both agencies which would clearly show that I do not have any outstanding balance due.

    In the meantime, I disputed the TL with the CRA which came back (remains) my documents were rejected and unacceptable to the CRA . so a re-investigation is now in process.

    after 1 week I called the OC back to hear a response that they don't have to talk to me and this is not a priority to them.

    so I asked for a supervisor, who stated she needed to pull their records from storage to investigate this matter further which will take time .

    I instructed both the CA and the OC in writing to immediately delete the inaccurate TL from my credit reports.

    it has now been over three weeks and the TL is still on there! (grrr )which wasn't even flagged disputed

    they have both ignored my request and demands to deleted the TL. I don't see any other way to resolve this without filing suit as the BBB and other agencies have been inaffective in the past with this CA

    any suggestions ?.
     
  14. fun4u2

    fun4u2 Well-Known Member

    Oh
    I failed to mention my credit score took a nose dive of over 100 points due to this one negative TL!
     
  15. ontrack

    ontrack Well-Known Member

    Regardless of the past effectiveness of a BBB complaint, always file one against both parties since they deserve that black eye. You still proceed with any other action you need to take, just with more visibility beyond just the people currently shirking their responsibilities.

    If you paid the account, yet it was still sold as unpaid, and neither party is cooperating in resolving the matter, other consumers should know what to expect should they choose to do business with this OC. Incompetence, fraud, and violations of law should have consequences.
     
  16. ontrack

    ontrack Well-Known Member

    What type of account is this? CC? Utility or phone service? Are they subject to any regulatory oversight under which additional pressure can be brought?

    How complete is your documentation that it was paid and closed? What were your FICO scores before and after? Other than this negative tradeline, are your scores generally high, so that any damage done is likely due entirely to this erroneous report?

    Did the OC try to collect their alleged account balance from you? If so, did you dispute and did they determine no amount was due? Was your final payment made in the normal course of closing out the account, against the final statement, or was this account in collection before being paid to the OC?

    Has the CA sent you a letter attempting to collect the alleged balance? In other words, is your dispute with them within 30 days of any initial collection letter received from them, or having never sent a collection letter, is your dispute in response to their credit report tradeline, which the CRA has apparently "verified"?

    In other words, with your records in order, and their actions unresponsive, and with real damages likely and proveable if this continues, dot your "i"s and cross your "t"s regarding FDCPA violations in preparation for legal action.
     
  17. fun4u2

    fun4u2 Well-Known Member

    I AM PREPARING NOW FOR THE STORM AHEAD I JUST HAVE THE JURISDICTION QUESTION IN REGARD TO THE FCRA AND FDCPA VIOLATIONS.

    IT IS SAD THAT ONE MUST GO TO SUCH LENGTHS TO PROVE INNOCENSE.

    ANY FURTHER SUGGESTIONS THAT YOU CAN OFFER ME IN THIS MATTER WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED.

    THX AGAIN
     

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