I sent out a letter of validation to a CA who is representing a lease default. They signed for the letter on the 10th (I sent CRRR)and today(14th) I recieved the reply(not CRRR by the way). What they sent me was a copy of my lease application, along with my brothers(we were roomies but he moved out) AND my lease renewal. They also sent an itemized list of the costs. $1200 for non payment $350 cleanup and $4000 for remainder of lease. A couple of things stick out here to me. 1. They turned all this around and had it at my doorstep in 4 days(again, NOT CRRR) 2. page 1 of the packet has a "Notice of claim on security Deposit" in my brothers name(who moved out before I renewed the lease.) Also the itemized charges are on this page. 3. They DID NOT send me a month by month payment history of the acct. from the day it started till I made the last payment they would recieve. According to what I have read this is NOT validation! I believe not only do theyu need to supply me with a contract, but a detailed account summarry provided by the OC! No way they did that in 4 days! Furthermore, the itemized charges are listed in my BROTHERS name on the "Notice of claim on security Deposit" . Now, what do I do? They did not send CRRR they cannot PROVE that I even recieved this bogus attempt at validation. Do I wait the 30 days out and follow up w/the 15 day letter? In addition to the "Notice of claim on security Deposit" form there is a form from the apartment management company titled deposit disposition. this also shows my brothers name and it lists the past due amounts of the rent($1000). In addition, while reading the fine print of my lease agreement it states "upon default you must pay remaining balance of lease OR until we rent your dwelling" This MAKES A HUGE difference in the amount owed should ti come to that. What basically is $5000 now would be as little (cough cough) as $1500 if they rented the unit the month after I left... Sorry for the repost just wanted to give more details. Thanks again Pk
They don't have to prove you received it. There is nothing in the FDCPA that says anything must be sent CRRR. If it goes to court all they have to do is show it to the judge and the theory will be if they have it now they had it then and sent it to you.
Ok I'll grant that. however this isnt even CLOSE to validation. 1st I dont see how it is possible for the OC to have dug up my contract and delivered it to the CA in just a day or 2. (The CRRR letter was signed on the 10th and the letter they sent me is dated the 10th as well)
Also there is still 26 days left in the 30 day validation period. Do I wait until 30 days since this isnt validation.. Im kinda confused.. What I EXPECTED would happen is that they wouldnt be able to produce the needed items (which they really didnt) and I would follow up with the 15 day "prove it or take it off" letter.
They don't have to prove you received it keepmine =================== Received what? The END ************************* LB 59
Re: Re: Validation in 4 days??? Ok Ok..The issue isnt so much did I get the letter or didnt I.. its more the case of do I fire back a: You didnt prove it so remove it letter. OR do i wait for 30 days and see if they violate(isputed with CRA's also)... Again from the many great posts on this site I have read that the CA must supply a detailed statement of the account, a signed copy of the contract and they must be obtained from the OC...They signed for my letter on the 10th ...they sent me the reply dated the 10th also(I rcvd today) Help?
KnoxPK, no offense but I think if you owe them money, you should pay them. I think what you are entitled to argue with them about is the exact $ you owe them. Based on what you said about your contract, you can tell them you owe them $1,500 and that's it. As far as not paying them because they cannot prove you received the "papers", I won't hold my breath if I were you. Just my 2 cents....take it for what it's worth. Good luck!
Ugh! I know everyone is trying to be helpful. However this question is more about validation and less about the ethics of me not paying. Basically this is the question..The CA has 30 days to validate this is MY account. They have failed to do so but its only day 4 in the validation process. I am satisfied that this will be the only attempt they make in this 30 days. I have also disputed this account with the CRA's I am certain based on their response that they will "verify" this account. I will have them for 1 violation then........I am also going to find out if they are even licensed and bonded in my state to collect(the debt was incurred in florida I live now in TN) if they are not thats 2 violations.. I will have some leverage. I am past the SOL they will not be able to sue me for anything. What I am wondering is do I attack now or do I wait for the 30 days to expire(at the very least i will wait for the CRA to verify or not verify).... as for doing whats right..this apartment complex was bottom of the barrel. They didnt do maintenance when needed, they cared less about rrequests we had concerning certain neighbors and top that off witht he CA listing the account with a balance date a year and a half AFTER I defaulted!! They dont care to much about ethics..I can prolly wait out the 2 years left for it to report but if htey cannot PROPERLY validate why should I? Dont want to sound like a Newbie Jerk but please someone help.. Thanks PK
Sorry KnoxPK. I didn't mean to preach to ya. Anyway, as far as validation.... I'm not an expert, but I think the copy of your lease and lease renewal (especially if you signed it) is a good enough validation. The experts on this forum might disagree with me though. But that's just what I think. Also, if you disagree that that's enough validation I think you should wait until the 30 days is up. If you attack now, they will still have 3 weeks to come up with whatever document needed to prove you owe them the money. If you wait until the 30 days is up, then their time is.... UP... >;-)
Gc Its ok..I just think the topic was getting sidetracked(my fault though).. I agree with you. I will wait. In the meantime can anyone tell me what agency or where can I search to find out if a particular CA is licensed and bonded in TN? Thanks guys
Someone help Knox with some Google searches for Secretary Of State for TN. When you get there look up collection agencies and see if a lic. is required.
thanks butch did a sear of sec of state..found the site..also found this http://www.tennesseeanytime.org/soscorp/ business info search.. The ca is NOT listed. Am I to assume(safely) that every company listed and licensed to do business in TN is listed here?
Re: Re: Validation in 4 days??? What does it say about licensing? In my state there is no license required BUT they must be "registered" to conduct business. Be sure you're not getting the 2 confused. If a lic. IS required and they're not on the list. I wouldn't assume they're not licensed. What I would do is call the TN SOS Monday morning and double check.
Re: Re: Validation in 4 days??? I know this isnt going to be helpful to anyone but I did read (somewhere) that they are to be licensed AND bonded in Tn to collect on an account. PK
Re: Re: Validation in 4 days??? http://www.state.tn.us/commerce/collect.htm#requirements Butch this link lists the license requirements so i am assuming they must be licensed to legally collect. Did I make sense just now?
Re: Re: Validation in 4 days??? YEOW!!! That is the most pathetic web site I've ever seen. LOL Try This: Collection Agency Licensing Requirements: The Tennessee Collection Service Act prescribes the licensing requirements for the operation of a collection agency in the State of Tennessee. (62-20-101, et seq.). Any person who, directly or indirectly, for a fee, commission, or other compensation, offers to a client or prospective client the service of collecting, or purchasing for collection, accounts, bills, notes or other indebtedness due such client for various debtors are subject to the licensing requirements under the Act. (62-20-102(3).) However, collection personnel of any court, attorneys at law, or any employees of a creditor are exempt from the licensing requirements. (62-20-103(a).) Any person who wishes to conduct collection services must submit an application for a license to the Tennessee Collection Service Board for approval and post a bond in an amount between $15,000 and $25,000 depending on the number of employees. (62-20-106.) Each location of the collection business must be registered and operated by a location manager. (62-20-105, 62-20-108.) A collection service must also keep and retain for a period of 3 years accurate individual records of collection, issue collection receipts upon request, maintain a separate fiduciary or trust bank account and maintain records and books reflecting the true condition of bank accounts at the end of each calendar month. (62-20-114.) The Rules of The Tennessee Collection Service Board (Chapters 0320-1 to 0320-4) set forth the qualifications, examinations, and fees requirements. Detailed information on licensing requirements may be obtained from: State of Tennessee Department of Commerce and Insurance Collection Service Board 500 James Robertson Parkway Nashville, Tennessee 37243 Tel: 615-741-1741
Re: Re: Validation in 4 days??? http://www.nationalcollection.net/licenses.htm Bonding is required also.
