"Validation " letter

Discussion in 'Credit Talk' started by S.D., Mar 5, 2001.

  1. S.D.

    S.D. Guest

    It may be a silly question, but is this sort of letter sent only to a collection agency or can it be sent to the actual creditor? I have a charge off that keeps coming back as "verified". I asked the creditors for any documentation such as signature, but they have sent nothing. I would like to take a different approach and would like to know how effective this "validation" letter is. Also, I was planning to dispute my previous address as "not mine" to see if that would help get this stupid charge off deleted. Any suggestions?
  2. Marie

    Marie Well-Known Member

    GREAT question!

    Since you're aware of the format of the validation letter, you know that a lot of it states that the debt is not yours etc etc. And w/respect to a collection agency, it isn't unless you've created a novation (new agreement).

    But, with original creditors, I am just now starting to use a modified validation letter to see if it will budge their positions.

    For example, if you asked the original creditor for the signed document, copies of all correspondence, payment schedules including payments posted etc etc (like we do w/the collection agency validation) then you would have a leg to stand on.

    I believe, in theory, you could ask for "validation" of an original debt because if they can't prove it to you and you've requested proof... and they continue to put it on the bureaus... then after the second letter it would be a deliberate willful and negligent act. They know they can't prove their position yet they continue to report.

    It wouldn't be a violation of the FDCPA, because they're not a collection company. But I think if you ask for proof and there is none, it would be a violation of the Fair Credit Reporting Act. Additionally, after you sent 2 "prove it or lose it" letters, you could send it to the bureaus and copy their department that enforces their contracts with creditors. The info creditors provide are supposed to be LEGALLY accurate. In this case, you might be able to shift the burden of proof and force an issue.

    The only problem is that you really wouldn't want to push it with respect to filing a lawsuit... well, maybe you could. As long as you blatantly didn't say "it's not mine" but instead just asked for proof, you wouldn't be lying...

    I did bluff my way thought a utility issue. I'd paid it 4 years previously and it came back CRA verified for 4 years in a row past payment.

    I did do a validation "not mine" to them b/c I knew they didn't have anything in writing . It was a utility company. And they had set it up w/ an incorrect version of my name, and they didn't have my ssn, just an old address (they I'd had removed from all the bureaus).

    The utility company removed it (3 times, actually) :_)
    But I knew they didn't have a shred of proof, so I bluffed and was a bit proud of myself for getting them back.

    With regards to getting addresses, I just called Equifax and they did it over the phone. You could also just send a letter saying it's incorrect, please remove. (normally their listings really do have something incorrect about them anyway). I prefer calling for silly things like addresses because it gets done quicker.
  3. geekpipe

    geekpipe Well-Known Member

    Re: GREAT question!

    couls someone share these validation letters, specificaly tailored to CRA, original creditor and also collection agency.

  4. geekpipe

    geekpipe Well-Known Member

    Re: GREAT question!

    Why would you send to the collection agency or original creditor instead or directly to cra? Dont you have a better quicker shot first through the CRA. If the cra comes back and could not verify it...isnt it off?

    Worst case scenario is they validate it and maybe then send your letters to the creditor and try your process?

    What is the cease and desist for if they never respond to your first letter of validation?

    Humor me i am new here :)

  5. Marie

    Marie Well-Known Member

    Re: GREAT question!

    Actually, send validation 1 and then 2, because it establishes a papertrail that the collection agency didn't respond, hence the debt doesn't exist.
    Then send the removal of credit letter.
    Then, and only then, you can send a cease and desist. Remember, if you're asking for validation you can't send a cease and desist. If they tried to validate they'd violate the cease and desist. See!

    You have to wait until the very last letter to do a c&D otherwise you set up their defense for why they couldn't validate the debt "We couldn't or we would've violated the cease and desist"

    The letters, in order, are:
    You can find the letters here:
    1. Debt Validation - experts please help thread 32878
    2. Debt Validation2 - experts please help thread 32879
    3. No Debt Validation=Remove trade line letter thread 32991
    4. Cease and Desist (if still necessary)
  6. Marie

    Marie Well-Known Member

    Re: GREAT question!

    Oh, you can combine letter 3 with a cease and desist. You tell them to fix your credit and then go away. :)
    Does this better explain it to you guys? I hope so. I know I was a bit confused at first too.

    Please read the sources I posted. It'll really help it all make sense.

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