Hi, this is my first message here. I am so upset...I just pulled my credit which was in the 700s, but all of a sudden there is a collection item dated from November 2000 for over 1700 from a dentist. I disputed the item that was first reported to the bureaus in Jan 2006. The bureaus contacted the collection agency who verified it and it has remained despite my attempts to dispute it. I called the dentist and he has no record of it. I called the collection agency and the lady was a nasty bit**. I called Experian back - first they said to call the dentist, I did they said they have no record of me. Then they said call the collection agency - I got nowhere with them, supposedly they had called me a few years ago, but couldn't say who they spoke to and the number they gave me was never mine. I never received the 30 day notice the mail at the start, but they said they have evidence I received it because it was never returned back to them undelivered! The credit bureaus said it has to stay for 7 years on my report. I never new of this until it was reported 6 years later, so is there any legal action I can take? It just seems so wrong and unfair! My home loan is to close in a week and I am ending up with a higher rate because of this stupid item that's not even mine. Experian said there were no managers available I could talk to! Ughh I feel like I'm getting unfairly screwed over. I'd rather pay the 1700 to an attorney to set the record straight than to a nasty agency who I don't owe. Please somebody tell me what to do. I gave the agency all of my updated info so I know now they will be sending me bills and notices...why don't they call the dentist? I said i have his number (I got it from 411), it took them 2 minutes to see they had no file under my name. This has already taken a couple of months, why doesn't anyone pick up the friggin phone and call the original creditor? Why do I have to be making all these calls and writing letters and still not get anywhere? Please does anybody know what I can do? Thank you, I am desperate and so upset... helpseeker
Regardless of the dentist's confirmation that you were not his patient, I presume you know you never used that dentist. You obtained your good credit record by careful management of your financial affairs. Despite all your care, you are learning that you are subject to the incompetence or malice of the lowest paid clerk at the poorest managed CRA or CA in the country. You disputed thru the CRA, who verified with the CA. The CA told the CRA that they intended to post this negative account on your credit report. That is all the CRA is required to do. That was the CA's opportunity to correct their mistake. The CA has also verified to you that they intended to collect this account from you, even though you determined that this was not your account, and that the dentist had no record of you. That was their second chance to correct their mistake, if they had intended to do so. If it is not your account, you can already see that playing nice will only cost you bad credit and higher interest for a debt you don't owe, and even more if you pay the debt, since then you will have the bad credit and be poorer the payment, too. It does not pay to play nice. Your loan may, or may not, go thru, or even be worth closing on if this erroneous TL increases your rate, but if it fails due to this CA, put the damages where they belong. If the dentist could determine that it was not your account, the CA could have determined that too. They clearly don't care who they collect from, or whether the debt is legitimate. By disputing thru the CRA, resulting in their "verification" of the erroneous account, you are ready to establish the responsibility of the CA for their TL posted on your credit report. Your pending loan will establish damages, if you are turned down, if the lender requires payment of the debt as a condition, or if your offered rate is raised. There is no more reason to play nice, as further delay only increases your damages. Put the cost of those damages where they belong. Read FDCPA and FCRA at the ftc.gov website, and see an attorney.
Thanks for taking the time to read my vent and respond "ontrack". I'll still get my loan - my mid fico was a 732 and it is now in the lower 600s i guess because how "new" this collection is "originated in 2000 but reported for the first time Jan. 2006 - news to me. That is just the feedback I needed to hear, that being nice will not get me anywhere. In fact I think it is getting me in a worse position because the stupid CA updated my contact info. I told the lady I got the Dentist's phone number (called 411) let me give it to you, call their office, it won't take 2 minutes they'll confirm I don't owe anything. She kept going back to the addresses I've stayed at over the past 10 years like she wasn't listening to me, just happy she "got me" on the phone. It was a nightmare of an experience to say the least. Anyways, I just wrote a two page letter and sent it to Experian (wonder if the other bureaus are reorting it too). My last resort will be to contact an attorney, I just hate to have to pay out of pociket for a debt I do not owe, in resolving it. In the meantime I am to sign my loan papers within a week or so and am qualifying for a higher rate than what I would have otherwise qualified for without this stupid thing coming onto my report SIX YEARS after the supposed original date of collection. You'd think Experian would contact the dentist. I called them back and said I had their number, they could call to verify what I'm telling them instead of going by wrong information by a CA who has a financial gain for me to pay them off. They said they only go by what the CA tells them!!! Man, our laws hardly make sense. The CA won't call the dentist, they have some mysterious request by them to collect on me. The CRA won't call, so strange...I just have to convince the third parties based on my word... Let's see if my latest letter will make any difference. The guy from Experian said he'd have a manager call me back, it's at the end of the day and nobody called back. The CRA's are owned by credit card companies, so the longer bad info is on the report, the higher your interest rates will be, both the CRA and CA have an interest not to make corrections seems like, and to give you the run around. Feels like I'm chasing my own tail and not getting anywhere...
"it is now in the lower 600s" Is your loan even worth it? At some point you walk. "She kept going back to the addresses I've stayed at over the past 10 years like she wasn't listening to me, just happy she "got me" on the phone." She isn't listening to you, she is following a script. This tells you the level of BS you will get in dealing with this particular CA any other way than in court. Dumb consumers, and CAs who prey on them, assume that if they know all that information, the consumer must be responsible for the debt, or it somehow proves they located the right party. It only proves they pulled either your credit report, which would list past addresses, or they pulled some report from various companies that maintain and merge address information for skip tracing. Much of this information is erroneous, and you know it is not your debt anyway. Pure BS intimidation. "My last resort will be to contact an attorney" You are already at your last resort, since the remaining choice costs you more. Do it now. The CA may cave, in which case you do rapid rescoring, minimimze your loan damage, and sue later anyway for their willfull FCRA and FDCPA violations. "I just hate to have to pay out of pocket for a debt I do not owe, in resolving it." It does NOT resolve it. It gets you a loan on terms worse than you deserve, and rewards illegal behavior. "You'd think Experian would contact the dentist. " All they do is electronically inquire of the CA if the TL is "correct". The CA has already said they consider it correct, even if they are wrong. The CRA considers the matter closed. It is between you and the CA. "The CA won't call the dentist, they have some mysterious request by them to collect on me." They have nothing to gain by calling the dentist. They probably bought a debt, probably for penneys on the dollar, which may or may not have been paid already, owed by someone else, possibly with a similar name, and they know you are over a barrel about to get a loan from pulling your credit reports. At 6 years old, it is probably past SOL, so they can't sue. All they can do is dunn you, threaten, and damage your credit, so that is what they are doing. And they will be very self-rightous about it too, you scumbag debtor! You talked to them on the phone, but you don't have any rights, to force them to "validate" the debt under FDCPA unless you dispute the debt in writing. They will probably even claim you don't have the right to dispute, but do it anyway. Your letters from now on should be written with an eye toward how they will play in court, when read by a judge. Read FDCPA. The notice they claimed to have sent you (which if they even sent one, they might have sent to someone else's address, perhaps even the true debtor's), should have notified you that you could dispute. Of course, they won't tell you that on the phone. The lie is as much in what they don't say as in what they do say. What you might do, is get a letter from the dentist stating that the debt is not valid. You will want such a letter anyway, if you need to go after the CA, especially if they fabricate some printout of their own and claim it is validation of the debt. If he doesn't want to get involved, tell him he is already involved, since this CA claims they are collecting on a debt he sold, that his own records show is not owed by you. If he won't cooperate, include him in your suit later against the CA. It will piss him off, but in the future maybe he will be more careful who he sells his bad debt to. See an attorney quickly. Don't depend on people doing what the law requires, or acting in good faith, when they have already shown they intend to do neither. They will follow the law better and faster if they receive a summons. It changes the stakes when they might have to pay out thousands trying to collect $1700 they bought for much less. By the way, a dental bill in this price range is a great one if you have to prove it's not yours. The dentist's records, if he ever claimed it was actually your account, would include what work was done, and at $1700, you know it would be fillings, crowns, bridgework, root canals, or something specific which would not match you. If it got to that point they would have to cave. They ID dead people with dental records. Better than signatures.
That's a good point that in the end, dental evidence will prove if the work done was on my moth (even though they don't have a file on me in their office!). I called the dental office after my last post, the manager guy was still there, he gave me his fax number I can send the info from my credit report to, so he could see what it's all about. I hate that I'm doing all the work when the CA and CRA who are the ones reporting it are not doing a single thing other than giving me a hard time. They're probably closed now, so I'll do that and fax to him, he was a very nice guy and I think he will help me get out of this mess and straighten things out. Unfortunately, my loan is for a home purchase with a contract, so I can't back out the last minute just because I want to wait for an error on my report to get corrected. I went into the deal thinking my scores were still high, then got the surprise. The closing date was originally a few weeks ago, i already got an extension and stalled it thinking it wouldn't take long to resolve this but to my surprise, nobody made the corrections or inquired to the dental office directly. It will cost me thousands more in the long run paying on the higher rate (which is on a very large sum loan). Had my credit been slightly poor to begin with, this could've even costed me the whole transaction! I am feeling a deep resentment towards the CA and it feels better that someone is there rading my complaint and even giving feedback - thanks! Imagine how desperate I was feeling to do a search to find a message board for these issues and was so excited I did lol Now I need a drink to get this out of my mind... thnx. Now that you mention it, I think she was reading a script. It was like our conversation was making no sense and she was interogating me. She knew all of the addresses I've ever lived at since birth, plus she knew my social so I think they have a copy of my credit report, which rally pisses me off. I had an address in another city, but only for tax reasons and other personal reasons, so she asked if I had ever lived in that city, I said no that I hadn't lived at that city before. Then she asked if I knew the address x at that city, I said yes, then she said she had already caught me on a lie and that our conversation was being recorded. I was going to hit the roof, she wouldn't let me talk saying "let me finish" and kept blabbing on when all I kept trying to tell her was to take the dentist's number from me to call themselves, which she never did!! I feel bad for anyone else in a similar situation, especially if they don't know it's on their report and they apply for credit, get turned down and say oh well, or their credit card rates jack up and they don't know why...They send colorful envelope with huge font print advertisements to get you to sign up for a credit card, but every time they raise your rate, it's in microscopic print somewhere on the statement you might not see. I had mine raised a few months ago, I called to ask why but got no clear answer, only that it was based on some formula of my spending habit, payments made, balance etc. Sounded just like the CRA when they give no clear answer on exactly why your score is the way it is, just a mysterious list of factors that could contribute, but no score tabulations next to each item: ex. if your name is misspelled by someone who pulls your credit and doesn't match your name on file (has happened to mine, it is a long name and sometimes people who pull my credit mis-spell a letter) I found out points get deducted from your report, and so on...big scam if you ask me but yes, it is a useful tool to determine who to lend money out to, but it also screws people over. Anyways, this is my long rant!!
Yes. It is a big scam. They may even be collecting on a debt they never had any reason to believe is yours, other than maybe a similar name. They might even have tried collecting from 10 people who might have been the debtor, and you are the one who responded. Do a search on "CAMCO". If you can get the dentist's office manager to fax them that this is not your debt, with a copy to you, it may get it off your reports fast. If not, see an attorney. Better yet, see one anyway, since even if they eventually remove it from your reports, they will take long enough to cost you. to get a faster response, hold their feet to the fire.
When your CC rate was raised, you shouldn't have settled for calling and getting just a vague answer. You write, and specifically ask for their reason for raising your rates, whether it is based on credit report information, and if so, which credit reports they pulled and used to make their decision. They are required to send you this information, in writing, when you request it. It is an Adverse Action Notice. You then use it to get copies of your credit reports from the CRAs they used, which the CRAs must provide to you FREE, if you send them a copy of that Adverse Action Notice. Sometimes, the only indication you have that something is wrong is that a CC rate goes up. Find out why and fix it. Do not accept any BS. No-one will thank you for being polite or delaying in forcing them to fix their messes. In fact, they will just blame you for causing trouble, since it must be your fault someone is trying to collect on you, and "everyone knows most debts are legitimate." Even if they finally fix it, it wasn't their fault it took so long and cost you so much. They are expecting easy money. Give them an incentive, and that all changes. Under FCRA, the court can also award attorney's fees.
"Then she asked if I knew the address x at that city, I said yes, then she said she had already caught me on a lie and that our conversation was being recorded." She was basically trying to intimidate you into thinking you had broken some law, and that therefore not paying her would get you into trouble with the law. Nice trick, aimed at unsophisticated consumers who can't afford legal representation. Of course, she didn't just say up front the whole call was being recorded ("to maintain quality"). That would have been the disclosure required by most states that require disclosure of recording. The whole spiel of reading back your addresses proves nothing, of course, other than that she had pulled your credit report. That only took your name and address. The dentist wouldn't have required a list of addresses to see a patient, so reading them back to you is no indication that you are that patient. But to the unsophisticated consumer, it appears they have been "investigated", again imputing authority to the debt collector, legitimacy to the debt, and implying a threat of legal action. "We know your addresses. You can't escape..." They are deliberately trying to skirt the line without being caught crossing it. That usually means they know their position is weak. http://www.ftc.gov/os/statutes/fdcpa/fdcpact.htm#807 "�§ 807. False or misleading representations [15 USC 1692e] A debt collector may not use any false, deceptive, or misleading representation or means in connection with the collection of any debt. Without limiting the general application of the foregoing, the following conduct is a violation of this section: ... (4) The representation or implication that nonpayment of any debt will result in the arrest or imprisonment of any person or the seizure, garnishment, attachment, or sale of any property or wages of any person unless such action is lawful and the debt collector or creditor intends to take such action. "
Ontrack, thank you for all of your feedback, help and support. That's a good poitn that the lady was trying to intimidate me. It worked because I got scared into thinking I shouldn't be talking without an attorney and maybe I blew it by something I may have said then she worked me. I'm just so angry about this. I was supposed to sign my loan papers tomorrow. The sellers are already packing up and moving today and they are expecting things to close. What I am pissed off about is that the lender informed me yesterday that all collection amounts due on the credit report must be paid by closing or at closing to the lender to pay out! I told them it is in dispute and they are not accepting that. I am so friggin angry right now I could pull my hair. I don't want to pay all that sum to the stupid collector especially when the dentist says I don't owe anything. I faxed a letter to the dentist's office lat night(to speed things up instead of mailing). I gave them my fax number too and asked that they fax back a letter stating I do not owe them anything. I have a 1 day deadline and am crossing my fingers that they will get back to me. At this point if they don't, they'll get money and the collection company will and my credit report won't be able get repaired. I am so friggin angry
What CA is this? What state are they in, and what state are you in? Some CAs have been nailed by state AGs for blatant violations of FDCPA and FCRA, and are under consent agreements to comply with state and federal law. If this is one, a call to your, or their, state AG, along with a copy of the dentist's letter confirming that there is no debt, might get a fast response. Also, see an attorney, and see if you can pay, in order to mitigate your damages, perhaps with your check indicating the debt is disputed, and still sue later.
That's a good idea to contact my AG. That's what I'm going to do today, thank you. I'll go see if he has a website or else mail a letter or something... I have been calling the dental office Mon tue and now Wed. I am supposed to talk to R. who I faxed the letter to and who i had spoken to last Fri. but now this lady picks up the phone, she has an attitude, she keeps saying R is w/ a patient (when he is the gen. manager of the desk...hmmm) that SHE got the fax, she doesn't see me anywhere as a patient but she has to do research to find out who may have fraudulently used my name to charge it and so on. I said that could take months, that would be good to find out but in the meantime I need a letter from them ASAP before I get an attorney involved. I have called THREE times today, each time she is telling me R will call me back!!!! My blood is boiling...their office is in Los Angeles, I'm in Orange County...with traffic and all it would take 2 hrs each way to go there in person. I am so angry I wish i didn't tell lher there is a loan involved. But now I am for sure going to contact the AG but in the meantime it looks like I will have to pay up and cross my fingers to get a refund. The other R guy in the office was so nice and accomodating, this bitch took over and is not letting me talki to the other guy!!!!!!! Maybe I should call back and ask to talk directly w/ the dentist, this is bullshit.
You are trying to do all of this yourself. As long as you do, both the dentist's office, and the CA, will take their own sweet time. That is one reason why you need to see an attorney. You might get a different response if he was contacting the two parties instead of you. In your present case, that is worth it. You have both $1700 at risk, and more thousands if your loan terms are raised. It is rational to spend several hundred, both to see what your legal options are, and possibly to shake loose a timely correction, whether or not there is a guaranteed correction. If you fail, you may still be suing for damages. If you succeed, you will have reduced your damages. You buy property, and take out a loan to do it, you have a lot more at risk than the monthly payment. You pay for professionals to protect your interests in the purchase, inspect to make sure you know what you are buying, and use other professionals where needed to make sure you get the best tax treatment and deductions. You pay for insurance for those risks you can insure against. This is no different. With the name of the CA, you can do a few searches to see if this is the sort of stuff this CA has pulled in the past. You can search BBB.org, ripoffreport.com, ConsumerAffairs, BudHibbs, general google.com, yahoo.com, and altavista.com, as well as ftc.gov, and several state AG sites, including your own, and the state in which this CA is based. You may find something interesting.
Well, I took ur advice and finally contacted an attorney. I told him what was up and he said if they don't resolve it after I call tomorrow, he will take over and give them a call etc. Let's see if the other manager (supposedly I was already talking to the manager) has to say about it and if she has any common sense...thnx.
It is interesting that this TL was not on your CR when your lender initially pulled the report, yet was there shortly later. It may just be coincidence, that for 6 years no CA tried to collect this erroneous account from you that they now claim you owe, when presumably you could be just as easily found thru your credit reports as now, yet at the moment you are applying for a mortgage, they just happen to pop up. It may be a coincidence, but it might be a deliberate collection strategy. Consider this hypothetical possibility, with just a hint of cynical paranoia: If I were a JDB, and I wanted to make money on out of statute debt (turning lead into gold), and I had no legal qualms about who paid me, I could buy a bunch of cheap debt, about 6 years old where it could still be put on CRs, yet was very cheap since it was past SOL and about to become unreportable, and then I could maximize the effectiveness of collecting knowing that my chances were best if the "debtor" were under time pressure, and had no time to make use of the legal protections available. (If he were not under pressure, he could just wait a year, and I would be stuck, limited to the usual intimidation techniques.) Many debts are not collectable because the debtor could not be located. For those debts where the name was fairly common, perhaps with several people of similar names in an average city, I could make use of the CRAs' services that would notify me of changes to alleged debtor's files. I could watch the files of several people of similar name to my debt, without any indication in their CRs that I am doing so, or that any collection account, erroneous or not, might be associated with their reports, and when one pops up with a new credit application, or especially a mortgage application, I could pull that credit report and decide my chances of pursuing that particular person as the debtor, using the credit report to guide my decision. I have a debt with a similar name, so that is my prop to support permissible purpose, if the issue went to court. If so, I place my CA TL on that report, and I know it might take months for even a knowledgable consumer to exercise their legal rights to remove it. In the mean time, I already know they were applying for a mortgage, may be purchasing a house, and are under the gun to close or lose the deal, with expenses exceeding the debt I am collecting. I could be mistaken. In fact, I am likely to be mistaken if I am watching several consumers' files with similar names. But the up-side is I will likely collect on the whole debt, which cost next to nothing, with little effort, since mortgage lenders usually require paying all outstanding collections before closing the loan. The lender acts as my CA. Viewed as a statistical class, people who are taking out mortgage loans have a better chance of being able to pay me than people who haven't paid a 6 year old debt. I only pursue "high quality" (high payoff) leads. What if someone calls my bluff? My first defense is that I had a legitimate loan, with this name on it, and I thought the consumer was that debtor. Bona fide error. The fact I bought the debt for 2 cents on the dollar has no bearing on my legal standing to try to pursue its collection. Since my liability does not start until the consumer has exercised their legal rights to dispute, and then to validate, all in writing, at snail mail pace, I can bow out, say I am sorry or not, and move on to the next case. It may cost the misidentified consumer thousands, but odds are that it won't cost me. It is hard to prove damages, and the amounts involved are often too low to interest an attorney. If I get paid, well, then the consumer has admitted he was the debtor, it's not my fault if he wasn't. Case closed, cha-ching. This may sound cynical, but there have been cases where similar strategies have been systematically employed. Increased use of consumer databases built from the sale of consumer information of questionable accuracy to locate consumers "efficiently", sale of large portfolios of old debt in electronic form with limited access to original information, the growth of collection firms attempting to collect on this debt from areas of low cost labor, all slant this part of the collection industry toward increasing errors in collection against consumers who don't owe debts. Some examples where the system has been "gamed": A case that went to court a few years ago involved a collections attorney who dunned around 10 people in one area with the last name to a debt he was collecting, but various first names or initials. When one answered, disputing the debt, he then sued that person. It turned out, of course, that that consumer did not owe the debt, and that at the time he filed suit, that attorney had no information that he was in any way connected with it. There were cases in the '90s, where in effect, CAs were pulling consumer reports to determine if there were outstanding debts, then approaching the original creditors and offering to take on the collection of the various debts found, using consumers' own credit files as marketting tools. That has since been ruled a violation of FDCPA, lacking permissible purpose for the original inquiry. When CAMCO was shut down a year agon, the FTC, in their complaint, indicated that as many as 80% of the CAMCO debts were not owed, already paid, discharged, or being pursued against the wrong party. There were reports in the local Rockford, Illinois, paper, based on interviews with now ex-employees, that they were trained to pursue collections against people of similar name to out of statute debts they had acquired, using demographic data to choose who to target based on who was likely to be an unsophisticated consumer, and therefore more likely to pay. If the consumer said they had never had an account with one CC company, they would then claim it was with some other CC company, but they still owed it. They also deflected any attempt by the consumer to request validation of the debt, along the lines of: "We already sent letters to you, you didn't dispute it within 30 days, so you lost your right to. Pay up." CAMCO also made use of the target's credit reports, to intimidate, lend legitimacy to their attempt to collect, as well as to threaten to re-report old debts. Every interaction you have with an opponent gives you a clue into their mindset; what they are likely to do, or not do, whether they are likely to comply with the law, what justifications they are likely to use when they don't. When they are willing to cross the line in one area, it tells you they are likely to be crossing it in others. If you know a debt is not yours, you have a clear picture of the extent of their bluff. Bluff may be enough to get you to pay debts you don't owe if you are in a bind, but keep in mind they also know the extent of their own bluffing, since they have deliberately chosen their business model and strategy, and systematically trained their people to follow it. Just as among animals, predators cannot risk injury in the repeated pursuit of their prey, predatory collectors as a part of their business model are not planning on being pulled into court and paying damages over each "innocent mistake" their strategy leads them to make. It has got to be "maximize profit, minimize costs, and if the risk is too high, cut and run." There are plenty of other accounts. If they are crossing the line, they are counting on it not being easily found out by any one consumer, but that does not mean there is no evidence.
(what does JDR stand for?) Very interesting analysis... I don't think it's a cynical view, but just an observant one. Interesting how they did "catch" me right when I had applied for a mortgage loan!!! Wow, this sounds like a big scam. The stupid dentist's office told me to call at 12:30pm after they meet with their manager...sounds odd that it's right around lunch time, but I'll see what they say. Both people I talked to confirmed they have no records of me at their office, yet they want to do all this investigative work before they send me the letter!!! I don't get how they're thinking, what they have to gain or if they are privy to this scam and have a deal with the collection agency to get a cut. I told the lady how fast I needed the letter, that I had to get it taken care of before the loan. Seems like they're as smart as you and think they are buying time, it will be 7 days as of tomorrow that they are stalling. So I thank you for your advice. When I talk tomorrow, I should not act like I am in a hurry maybe. I don't know, I just know I'm fed up and it seems so wrong. I didn't know collectors actually buy debt. I want to ask to talk to the dentist tomorrow, I'm sure he should be a little smarter than the people at the office who are trying to be important trying to collect a debt from someone who's not even a patient. It is SO annyoing!!!! ughhh I have no patience for these petty types.
JDB = Junk Debt Buyer, a debt collector who buys old debt, often for pennies on the dollar. "When I talk tomorrow, I should not act like I am in a hurry maybe." Fact is, you are in a hurry. What you want is for both the CA and the dentist to have clearly in mind that if they don't hurry, a freight train is accellerating that will run them over. You want them to share your panic. The dentist is probably not part of a scam. He may have assigned or sold a debt, for treating someone else, to this or some other CA, and if it was sold, it may have been resold. If he has a bad account, he probably holds it for a few months, sends it to a CA for a few months, and then outright sells it and writes off the loss after that. None-the-less, at this point, you don't even know for sure if this account was assigned or sold, and if it was assigned, he may still be on the hook for the illegal actions of his agent. What is missing so far is that you may not have pinned down the CA's (or the dentist's) liability under specific federal or state laws, so no clock is running, encouraging them to hurry. You cannot do that by phone alone! Disputing and requesting validation of the debt under FDCPA must be done in writing, otherwise the CA can just ignore you with impunity. If you haven't already, you should dispute, in writing, the entire debt, and request all documents they claim support it. Write your dispute with the wording of the FDCPA section in mind: Request: 1) the amount of the debt; 2) the name of the creditor to whom the debt is owed; 3) the name and address of the original creditor, if different from the current creditor. This is to literally fit the FDCPA wording, so that their failure to provide it should make a judge's later decision easier. You might also indicate some of the scope of your likely legal action to come, should they fail to resolve this quickly. Why not? (Have your attorney review, of course.) Refer to how your originally found this on your credit report, when you called to try to determine what it was about, that you were informed by Ms. Nice that it was a dentist bill, and that you had never even been to that dentist, and have confirmed with them that you are not in their billing records. Memorialize your conversation with Ms. Nice, including her attempted intimidation and implied threat of prosecution. They can say it didn't happen, but it puts it on the table. See this for illegal false or misleading representations: http://www.ftc.gov/os/statutes/fdcpa/fdcpact.htm#807 See this for your right to request validation of the debt: http://www.ftc.gov/os/statutes/fdcpa/fdcpact.htm#809 "�§ 809. Validation of debts [15 USC 1692g] (a) Within five days after the initial communication with a consumer in connection with the collection of any debt, a debt collector shall, unless the following information is contained in the initial communication or the consumer has paid the debt, send the consumer a written notice containing -- (1) the amount of the debt; (2) the name of the creditor to whom the debt is owed; (3) a statement that unless the consumer, within thirty days after receipt of the notice, disputes the validity of the debt, or any portion thereof, the debt will be assumed to be valid by the debt collector; (4) a statement that if the consumer notifies the debt collector in writing within the thirty-day period that the debt, or any portion thereof, is disputed, the debt collector will obtain verification of the debt or a copy of a judgment against the consumer and a copy of such verification or judgment will be mailed to the consumer by the debt collector; and (5) a statement that, upon the consumer's written request within the thirty-day period, the debt collector will provide the consumer with the name and address of the original creditor, if different from the current creditor. (b) If the consumer notifies the debt collector in writing within the thirty-day period described in subsection (a) that the debt, or any portion thereof, is disputed, or that the consumer requests the name and address of the original creditor, the debt collector shall cease collection of the debt, or any disputed portion thereof, until the debt collector obtains verification of the debt or any copy of a judgment, or the name and address of the original creditor, and a copy of such verification or judgment, or name and address of the original creditor, is mailed to the consumer by the debt collector. (c) The failure of a consumer to dispute the validity of a debt under this section may not be construed by any court as an admission of liability by the consumer. " .
Personally, I would go to my local court and get a form to file suit, fill it out and drive directly to the dentist office and tell them that this will be filed without further notice if they do not get off their lazy butts and do something about it. I would also file a police report and over-night a copy of that to all 3 CRA's. (If it is listed on all 3) Request that the CRA's block the bogus collection. I had a similar situation a few years ago. It was a case of a skip trace gone bad.
Note that since it is not your debt, they do not have permissible purpose to pull your reports. (Their claim to have a debt in your name, which may be found to be erroneous, may be a defense, but they would have to raise it. You don't have to just take their word, make them prove it. Did Ms. Nice pull your report again when you called, even as you were disputing it was not your debt?) Also note that you never received any of the letters they claimed they sent. (Since this is your first contact with them on this debt, they must send you a letter within 5 days of that first contact, notifying you of your dispute rights, as per FDCPA Sec. 809. Have you received that letter? They probably claim they sent that to you already. ("Our letter didn't come back, so you must have got it.") Then they know when and what address it was sent to. Probably not any of yours, or not when you lived there, despite their lame attempt to convince you they already knew all your addresses, so they must have sent it to the right one.) Make them put it in writing. Their own lies will trap them, since they're so used to doing it, and they know it. Demand what you want: Immediate removal of this erroneous debt from your credit reports. Send CRRR. Send a second one Certified, special delivery. Time is NOT on your side. They already know it, so you are not fooling anyone by pretending it is. You have already been more reasonable than they deserve, while their actions have been sloppy, negligent, or malicious. They wrongly damaged you, not the other way around, and they are continuing to do so, so you are becoming a potential creditor of them. Start acting like it. Your attorney can call to follow up, showing you mean business. If either party says they will look into it and get back to you, say you want it faxed by end of business tonight, and follow up with a summary of the conversation, including your demand, fax it, and send a copy Certified as paper followup. If they don't respond in time, call and ask where their reply is. Follow up, in writing. Keep driving it forward to the required conclusion. If you get no immediate response, there is no reason to wait since you already have violations. You can add more later, too. Manners get you nowhere. At each delay you accelerate, not wait patiently. "Time is of the essence."
"Personally, I would go to my local court and get a form to file suit, fill it out and drive directly to the dentist office and tell them that this will be filed without further notice if they do not get off their lazy butts and do something about it. I would also file a police report and over-night a copy of that to all 3 CRA's. (If it is listed on all 3) Request that the CRA's block the bogus collection. I had a similar situation a few years ago. It was a case of a skip trace gone bad." As this is likely either id theft, or misidentification, that might be a way to get rapid credit report correction. You know with certainty it is not your debt. They have verified the debt to the CRA as your debt, and told you your identifying information is associated with it (whether it was originally, or whether they are now lying or made a "mistake"). That fits within the category of "id theft". The CRAs can (and are required under FACTA) to directly respond to id theft disputes sent with a police report by prompt removal within a specified number of days. Go down both paths. Don't drop direct disputes and depend only on id theft and a police report. You can still proceed down the FDCPA violation path, with its statutory penalties, to force more rapid compliance. http://www.ftc.gov/os/statutes/fdcpa/fdcpact.htm#813 "�§ 813. Civil liability [15 USC 1692k] (a) Except as otherwise provided by this section, any debt collector who fails to comply with any provision of this title with respect to any person is liable to such person in an amount equal to the sum of -- (1) any actual damage sustained by such person as a result of such failure; (2) (A) in the case of any action by an individual, such additional damages as the court may allow, but not exceeding $1,000; or (B) in the case of a class action, (i) such amount for each named plaintiff as could be recovered under subparagraph (A), and (ii) such amount as the court may allow for all other class members, without regard to a minimum individual recovery, not to exceed the lesser of $500,000 or 1 per centum of the net worth of the debt collector; and (3) in the case of any successful action to enforce the foregoing liability, the costs of the action, together with a reasonable attorney's fee as determined by the court. On a finding by the court that an action under this section was brought in bad faith and for the purpose of harassment, the court may award to the defendant attorney's fees reasonable in relation to the work expended and costs. "
